Socialist Hacker?

By on October 14, 2009 2:43:36 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

playgroundl...

Join Date 07/2009
+10

check out this screenshot.

 

he could have very well been kidding. we did get the connection screen bug before it. but game ran fine for a few minutes afterwards. If fox news has taught me anything, it's not to trust a socialist. Your thoughts?

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October 14, 2009 2:53:06 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

what?

Hell no! we got the invalid error after he said that. 5 sec after he said it at least

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October 14, 2009 2:54:08 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Yeah he did say that, and the error window popped right up lol.

 

his other ally had to disc out when the connection bug happened. so he was stuck 3v2 and in the pic you can see a dead sedna, so it was 3v1 and he disc hacked us.

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October 14, 2009 2:56:21 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

it wasnt Waldo cause i know him so.... it was Socialist

Besides Waldo has many losses. it was him

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October 14, 2009 2:58:15 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

That would explain his "rank 50"

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October 14, 2009 3:05:44 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Also, if you browse through his played games. Any game with an N/A he has an asterix next to his name....... yeah I think he's caught for good. invalid gamestates dont pop up period.

 

any game where he loses, he has a asterix for a disc. any game where it's na, there's an asterix for a disc, and any game for incomplete = asterix for a disc. invalid gamestates do not appear in games list. who knows how many games he's screwed people over.

 

I've also played with him a handful of times. we always won, he never disconnected, and we never got errors. All signs point to ladder abusing no talent ass clown.

 

 

DOWN WITH SOCIALISM

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October 14, 2009 5:50:12 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Have sent in a request to ban.

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October 14, 2009 6:06:04 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting Frogboy,
Have sent in a request to ban.

Oh shite!  I thought it was funny, but fair enough.  Triggering invalid gamestate=poop. 

Melagan "yaaaay"  lolz...

I'd be pissed too, though. 

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October 14, 2009 6:25:36 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

ive experienced that error a few times. is it always "hand made"? then i guess there should be a thread about that where we can post screenies or information when it happend and who propably caused it.

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October 14, 2009 6:29:53 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

can someone post up a pic of the ban hammer please?

 

+1 karma to whoever does it first.

 

 

or to anyone who just posts it repeatedly too. that's cool as well

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October 14, 2009 6:47:06 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

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October 14, 2009 6:49:07 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

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October 14, 2009 6:51:17 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting Frogboy,
Have sent in a request to ban.

 

While I'd love to see any hacker/exploiter totally banned, perhaps an offer of a pardon if he'll give up the specifics on how he's doing it (via private communication, of course) would be in order.  Better to figure out how/why it happens and stop it for good than to eject people from an already small community after the fact.

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October 14, 2009 6:58:01 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting Bolange,

Quoting Frogboy, reply 6Have sent in a request to ban.
 

While I'd love to see any hacker/exploiter totally banned, perhaps an offer of a pardon if he'll give up the specifics on how he's doing it (via private communication, of course) would be in order.  Better to figure out how/why it happens and stop it for good than to eject people from an already small community after the fact.

 

I agree, we don't need a witch hunt. But I ask you to go to his online profile.... and click on any page of his games listing. I randomly chose some page further down. Saw the same crap. If he loses, na, no result, asterix next to his name.

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October 14, 2009 7:02:11 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

I think most of the time invalid gamestates are just weird things that happen that are beyond anyone's control.

However, if you've got an extremely high "win" %, you actually say you are going to try to trigger said invalid state to avoid a loss, and said event occurs, you're in big trouble.

It's not hard to trigger invalid gamestates. There is nothing that can be done. It's something I've personally spent time looking into and the reality is, as long as you have a game that is using LUA in the way Demigod has, you can always have someone who simply monkeys with the data being sent over and trigger said event.

What GPG/Stardock can do is simply log more data, which has been done recently.

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October 14, 2009 7:13:55 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

there is something you can do: don't allow file modifactions when the game is already running. there are several possiblities to accomplish that. well actually i donÄt mean that the files cannot be changed anymore during client running, but that the content is already read into memory those it will not affect the running cleint. you could even load scripts into an encrypted file on disc, with an at runtime generated encryption key if you have memory problems.

i dont really know how dg handles this but there is definitly allways a way to prevent such manipulation or at least detect them, as long as they do not have an hacked os.

or do you assume they directly hack the memory? well, in that case it this could be detected too, directly from the client and could inform you guys of this manipulation.

 

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October 14, 2009 7:16:05 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting Frogboy,
Have sent in a request to ban.

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October 14, 2009 7:54:43 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting Frogboy,
Have sent in a request to ban.

Very good, Frogboy.  I'm glad someone finally provided some proof for something I suspected all along (i.e., that this error could be intentionally caused).  I hope that this SocialistRyan guy never has another chance to stink up another Demigod match.

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October 14, 2009 8:40:01 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting Frogboy,
I think most of the time invalid gamestates are just weird things that happen that are beyond anyone's control.

However, if you've got an extremely high "win" %, you actually say you are going to try to trigger said invalid state to avoid a loss, and said event occurs, you're in big trouble.

It's not hard to trigger invalid gamestates. There is nothing that can be done. It's something I've personally spent time looking into and the reality is, as long as you have a game that is using LUA in the way Demigod has, you can always have someone who simply monkeys with the data being sent over and trigger said event.

What GPG/Stardock can do is simply log more data, which has been done recently.

Agreed.  It can be triggered intentionally AND simply happens... one's obviously an exploit and it stands to reason there are patterns in individuals who use it as an exploit.  I am glad to hear that you guys are logging more data and have are moving on data when you are confident of exploiters. 

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October 14, 2009 11:32:02 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Gonna be a dick here and he has told me he knows how to do it...

That said, I've yet to see him actually do it in-game, even when he is losing. And he seems like a decent enough guy. I'd talk with him about it first before you ban...

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October 15, 2009 2:14:49 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

I've played a metric crapton of games with SocialistRyan, and never seen it desync.  He's got 138 losses, for crying out loud - and he plays most of his games with tshughes, futileemotion, and me - all of whome have FAR higher win ratios then he does.  If he was desyncing, you'd think he'd do it here:

 

http://pantheon.demigodthegame.com/game/1018076/player/64310/

He didn't desync it in the game where we got a drop and tshughes lost an 80 game win streak because of it.  His win record is CRAP considering who he plays with, because he pugs and takes losses.  It's unfortunate timing or something, but I've played literally 100+ games with ryan and never seen a desync.  

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October 15, 2009 2:17:52 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Regardless of what he's said, I very much doubt SocialistRyan knows how to invalid gamestate hack.  He goofs around a lot, but he's a damn fine player (he won some cash in a demigod tournament, if I recall).  The fact that he doesn't lose isn't suprising when you consider who he plays with, and against.  I've never seen him do anything cheating wise.  Make crass comments, but NEVER cheat.

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October 15, 2009 2:54:51 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

And lets assume he *did* desync that game - After another bug gave his team an automatic loss.  The connectivity bug is vicious.  So he, in one game, said he wanted to see if he knew how to use it, after the game had *already ended* due to another glitch?  (And if you don't think the game was already over, any time you get an AI and you WEREN'T walking over the, it's over.  If you WERE walking all over them, it's an even game).  It's not like he's actually using that desync to go and never record a loss.  Worst case - absolute worst case - this was a case of experimentation in a game that was already over.  

If you want to ban a player for that, after letting people like Belier and Apika run around for OVER TWO MONTHS after EVERY PLAYER IN THE GAME knew they were COMPLETELY FULL OF SHIT, thats a horrible fucking double standard.

Note that we had multipel threads about Belier and Apika in AUGUST.  The record made it *obvious* what was going on.  *Every* top player in the game knew it, no one had any doubt, no one ever defended them, and not a single thing was done until they did it to Frogboy?   For TWO MONTHS? Thats customer service....

And then to ban someone for trying it, once, in a game that was already over due to a MASSIVE GLITCH that I have not seen you guys make a single post addressing, which is happening more and more?  After 500 legit games, well over 100 losses, and him never actually desyncing a  game that anyone cared about?  

That would say a lot about Stardock customer service to me.

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October 15, 2009 3:02:48 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

And if you want to say that he did something wrong because it affected the rankings (after one of your bugs gave a team a win), when are you even going to address the "incomplete" games thing?  I'm bloody sick of having someone on the other team drop and the game becomes an incomplete or never shows, and taking a loss every time someone on MY team drops.  I've got something like two legit losses in my last 100 games, and about 15 DC losses, and then about 20 wins that don't show due to various bugs.  Given the something like 20-30% chance of a game either showing up as an incomplete or not showing up at all that seems to be happening today, one experimental desync after the connectivity bug, who even cares?

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October 15, 2009 3:12:19 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

I know it's tedious to micromanage warnings, followups, and then eventual bans, but with such a small community I'm pretty ambivalent to see an active player go, even if he did desync on purpose a few times.

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October 15, 2009 3:55:04 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

I can't add much to the excellent points already made, but I can tell you that I too have played at least 100 games with Ryan, a few of which were losses, and he has never dysynced. Some would say his record is high, but if he was actually concerned about getting losses then his record would be much better. I believe the fact that he has 137 losses says it all (many of which are due to dc's, connections issues, and playing on his own against premades). If he was concerned about his record, why would he play against me, for instance, guaranteeing that one of us will take a loss? He lost this game, by the way, and it's only one example:

http://pantheon.demigodthegame.com/game/1026911/player/64310/

I'll admit that Ryan can be rude to people, so it's understandable that no one gives him much credit. But Sarmis, FutileEmotion and I have played many of you commenting here and you know we're honest players. We wouldn't play with Ryan if he pulled crap like this. To my knowledge he never has. So even if many of you don't trust Ryan, and I'll admit that he's given you no reason to, I ask that you please trust Sarmis, FutileEmotion and I, because I think we've earned it, and we vouch for him.

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