Lord Erebus.

By on August 12, 2009 3:26:06 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

[ShakeNBake]

Join Date 05/2009
+7

Needs a nerf. I don't care how. But he needs one.

Pretty much all the games I have played recently have had at least one Erebus in, and I don't know what the hell is going on because I never had problems with them before, but at the moment with max minions, max bite, 1 point in swarm and 1 point in stun there is NOTHING you can do against it. It totally owns from level 2 until the game finishes and you simply cannot touch him.

I CAN'T EVEN MAKE THEM LOSE ANY HP, AND THE DPS THEY HAVE IS INSANE.

/rage

 

Locked Post 192 Replies
Search this post
Subscription Options


Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 12, 2009 3:34:55 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

OMG OAK IS OP TOO. HE HAZ SPIRITS


LETS NERF HIM.


Good god people. I hope this is a sarcastic post.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 12, 2009 3:39:06 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

.

 

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 12, 2009 3:51:32 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

I semi-agree. Giving him the space to level/let him get money he doesnt even need to invest in minions skills other then one point in conversion (and the extra nightcrawlers) making him an INSANELY durable low mana usage assasin/general.

As a rook myself hes doable with some minions but with about 8 nightcrawlers, siegers, bishops, kings, 6k+ hp and bite theres just no point in even trying to do something. I just walk away and go play with my barbies.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 12, 2009 3:55:20 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

.[/quote][quote who="Polynomial" reply="1" id="2335381"]OMG OAK IS OP TOO. HE HAZ SPIRITS


LETS NERF HIM.


Good god people. I hope this is a sarcastic post.

 

Perhaps you accept that there are balance issues. But it sucks if a game , which is based on multiplayer, is so imbalanced

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 12, 2009 4:02:02 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

There are no serious balance issues! God. People just go in the forums an bitch about the game they just lost because something seemed to be "OP".

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 12, 2009 4:52:46 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting Polynomial,
There are no serious balance issues! God. People just go in the forums an bitch about the game they just lost because something seemed to be "OP".

 

Ah man. I recommend you to play vs a half-way good Minion EB. Then we can continue the discussion.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 12, 2009 5:02:05 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Oh please. I've faced ton. I've played with one. People just don't play with organized teams. So they complain when they get their ass kicked because they were playing a 1v1 game.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 12, 2009 5:31:57 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

TO START. His base move speed definitly needs knocking down to 6.0
That way you can at least attempt to run away from his minions.


(At the moment, as rook, even if you were to take a +15% move speed item, you would still be at 6.2 and unable to escape him or his minions without a teleport - which he will probably stun, and if you fake cast, you'll be dead before you can cast it again).

Stacking armor seems to not work vs minion bite erebus.
Stacking hp             ^
Stacking hp regen    ^
Stacking life steal    ^
Stacking damage     ^

I seriously cannot think of a counter to this build. It can outlast all other demigods in the game - then chase them down.
Can anyone give me a viable counter to it?
Especially as a rook, but as any demigod at all would be a start.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 12, 2009 5:36:29 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

[quote who="[ShakeNBake]" reply="8" id="2335518"]TO START. His base move speed definitly needs knocking down to 6.0
That way you can at least attempt to run away from his minions.

(At the moment, as rook, even if you were to take a +15% move speed item, you would still be at 6.2 and unable to escape him or his minions without a teleport - which he will probably stun, and if you fake cast, you'll be dead before you can cast it again).

Stacking armor seems to not work vs minion bite erebus.
Stacking hp             ^
Stacking hp regen    ^
Stacking life steal    ^
Stacking damage     ^

I seriously cannot think of a counter to this build. It can outlast all other demigods in the game - then chase them down.
Can anyone give me a viable counter to it?
Especially as a rook, but as any demigod at all would be a start.[/quote]

 

That's because you are thinking the wrong way. This is not a 1v1 game. This is a team game.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 12, 2009 5:56:31 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Without the Horn of Battle rook can hold off EB fine if you protect your static towers well enough. Generally I find that if I have the tower's AoE splah to retreat to my own towers will be enough to fend EB off early in the game. Bear in mind boulder+slam I is 700 damage, which isn't half bad. If you drop that on a group of night walkers at 70% or so HP it'll kill them unless the guy's going with a pure minion build and skipping bite.

Basically I just try to stalemate until level 9 when I get hammer II, at which point I have the damage to burn them down quickly. Getting hammer II at level 8 and hammer III at level 9 can also work but honestly I just find the mana consumption too much to maintain without rank IV towers. The siege hat really does pretty respectable AoE damage to the little guys if you're lucky enough to have it target them (which it usually does since it seems to prefer DGs and EB tends to move inside of his swarm most of the time).

The main thing is that 1v1 early and mid game rook will struggle with the buggers no matter what unless you get some support. Generally I find that a single monk is enough to keep me in the game. I'll just hug a tower and build my own around it, burning slams only to save myself or stop a full-on minion rush on the tower.

Honestly if HoB never comes back I don't think the coven swarms will be as big of an issue for Rook. The battle seems fairly even to me, with Erebus having the advantage if you push forwards too early and Rook having the advantage if he can survive to level 7'ish without feeding and then becoming a bit of a blowout in the rook's favor if you make it to 11 without feeding.

The specific approach you're talking about is risky for the EB as well, as warping into the tower farm before minions swarm in to distract tower fire is going to subject EB to some crazy damage and it turns it into a race to see who wins. If he's burning his stun on the approach there's a good chance you can just use a healing potion in his face.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 12, 2009 6:02:00 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

That's because you are thinking the wrong way. This is not a 1v1 game. This is a team game.

polynomial: Sampling through your game history tells me that you play in a 4 or 5 man premade team almost exclusively. Also your games seem to be against PuGs almost exclusively. I have nothing against that!

BUT

Of course you do not have the same problems as the average player, like noone teleporting in to help you, leaving you to flee or die in a 1vs1 against a Minion Erebus. A good premade team owns every build if the opposing team is PuG!

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 12, 2009 6:10:42 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Well, I think erebus may be OP, BUT i will say that I lost using a pure minion build with a premade team vs a better premade team. I play in a pretty casual clan, so the premades I find myself in aren't really good. We do use teamspeak so we manage to communicate with each other though. 

Anyways, the enemy team had 3 names that i recognized from the forums, whereas my guys just get on to play the game every now and then. They were spit UB, snipe/mines reg, and a shield QoT of some sort. They would constantly try to snipe and spit on one target (preferably me since I wasn't HP stacking very much). Bishops gave me some regen to try and out-live their spits and snipes but it was really tough to stay near flags. They killed us with giants at warscore 8.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 12, 2009 6:16:04 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting CosMoe,
Of course you do not have the same problems as the average player, like noone teleporting in to help you, leaving you to flee or die in a 1vs1 against a Minion Erebus. A good team owns every build if the opposing team is PuG!


But you can't balance a game, especially Demigod, for people who are not on an organized team. If there is something that seriously tips the side of a game when both teams are organized and coordinated then you have an argument. But you cannot balance something for PUGs where they are playing the game at a completely different level.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 12, 2009 6:27:34 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Im going to assume you were having problems in the pantheon eh [shakeNbake]?

Well it sucks going against a good minion erebus, especially if you are focused on towers early game and you dont have your hammer slam aoe, which lets be honest isnt a great aoe attack as it has to be wound up and if you get stunned doing that well you're screwed right there, though i'm going to hope you boulder rolled eb first ^^.

What makes things worse is your teammate is most likely a rook or regulus... and if he is new might not be going mine in which case he is absolutely worthless. Sorry just my own experience trying rook in pantheon.

I dont want to see him nerfed though, he was already nerfed and to be honest i find a spirit assassin oak to be bit better with the added damage % taken after penitence, although bite does reduce armor... maybe i take that back and just say oak would need as much rebalancing.

I do think a minion oak is the natural counter to a minion eb though. Eb doesnt have any aoe besides stun and mist and he probably isnt going mist with minion build where as oak has a good aoe attack that also adds benifits for his soldiers.

Rock, Paper, Scissors... unfortunately UB and EB are most played on darkside and Rook, Reg are most played on lightside in pantheon and that matchup is a nightmare, for me atleast. But maybe im just not pro

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 12, 2009 6:33:50 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

But you cannot balance something for PUGs where they are playing the game at a completely different level.

True that.

I guess that all these cries (also my own) for Minion Erebus nerfing came from 1vs1 or PuG experiences where there clearly is a problem.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 12, 2009 6:39:53 PM from Stardock Forums Stardock Forums

Just want to throw this out there....

Against a minion based erebus, he very rarely steps into a battle himself, and if he does he's generally far weaker than most other DG's due to his spending gold on minions and mana items (to keep said minions alive). Secondly, Minions in this game face a gigantic problem in that melee based minions just about stop attacking if you keep moving. In general, what my team does with a minion based erebus is to invest quite a bit in the static towers (especially damage), and if possible, catch the lightly armored Erebus and either knock him out of the fight by forcing him to mist, or kill him entirely. If he's staying out of the fight, then the minions alone with no bite are hardly giving off the kind of DPS a regular DG would be doing. And if the minions are on you.. stay moving. He'll either change targets or waste time chasing you.

The minions are great tower busters, but if you invest your gold properly, you can at least mitigate what a minion erebus is capable of. Also, if you know you're going against an Erebus, you're probably better off having something AoE happy on your team. Mine regulus or a fire Torchy are good picks. As for the rooks in this thread.. I have nothing I can suggest for you guys. Personally I think tower rook is a great early game choice, but even if you get 6 or 8 towers, after a certain point they just don't do enough damage, and by this point, Erebus's minions can probably mow through your towers like toothpicks. (So the strategy for you boys is rush rush rush, something you're not pulling off without a coordinated team).

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 12, 2009 6:43:17 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

it was in pantheon and my team-mate rook was doing some pro feeding. but even so, i had good items, my solid slam build, and i felt confident, yet every time i tried to take on the erebus he TOTALLY destroyed me. i barely even did any dmg. he had no skill whatsoever, just bite and click my hero. he didnt even attempt to avoid slams. i had 6k hp and he had 4k. and i couldn't touch him. i tried out the erebus build in single player and went on a monster killing spree.

i didnt think tower build was any good vs minion builds because the towers never focus the right target, so i always go slam.

i just played a custom game as UB (+oak) vs erebus (+reg). again my team-mate did a bit of early game feeding. but i was ready to unleash a pro spit + ooze + parasite egg build this time. we won, but it was VERY VERY difficult to get a kill, there was no way it should have been that hard, and we were trading kills thoughout the game. the game ended at level 19. on prison.

in my eyes, minion bite erebus has EVERYTHING you could possibly need in a game of demigod. high move speed, a slow, an armor debuff, healing minions, heals through bite, tonnes of dps through minions and lifesteal (lvl 15). it can outlast ANY other demigod in the game without needing to go back to base. if you fail to kill it as an assassain, he will be back to full hp in no time.


it just feels way way way too strong, to play as, or against.

i might just play erebus or ub next pantheon and that will put an end to these QQ threads at least.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 12, 2009 6:44:28 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

the problem with moving, is that as rook even if you move, they still hit you.
i had no problems keeping moving as UB however, which may be one of the reasons we eventually won.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 12, 2009 6:48:20 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

i didnt think tower build was any good vs minion builds because the towers never focus the right target, so i always go slam.
It's certainly not easy, but a lot of the build's problems stemmed from the horn of battle. New minions were constantly being created and those new minions were invulnerable damage sponges for 10 seconds, so it was just impossible to make reliable progress on the swarms, but now it's easier to break even, though you certainly won't be trouncing the other guy, at least not early on.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 12, 2009 8:23:18 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums
I noted from playing the Demo that poor Rook has really hard time with Erebus. I mean it's impossible to kill the bastard. This may not be true of other Demigods, or it may be true, but I play Rook mainly. One thing that got me thinking is that Hammer Slam should be rather effective vs him, because his DPS is just insane with ton of little minions about (and I'm hoping this would clear them). But I never go Hammer slam, so I have not tried it. My non-hammer-slam build is just so good against every other DG, especially other rooks, that I don't feel like using different build to face down just one Demigod our of 4. In the end I get a lead with kills on other demigods before I fight Erebus.
Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 12, 2009 8:32:57 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Hammer slam is pretty tricky to use against Erebus if he has half a clue. You have to rely on him wasting his batswarm *and* mist with feints, and even then it's pretty sketchy if you manage to lead him correctly with it.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 12, 2009 8:43:14 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums
Well to me the idea of it is to kill his minions, if you manage to nail this slippery fellow all the more power to you lol
Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 12, 2009 8:44:15 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

i too have vsed a few erebus recently, that have been almost impossible to kill. They evade too much, move to fast, stack health alot. with all that goignon he still moves fast, so i dunno wtf items they get. So i decided to do an evasive build myself, man was that was a failure and a half.

but i dont think he needs to be nerfed. ppl have just found his highest potential. time to do so for the rest.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 12, 2009 11:22:04 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting gkrit,
i too have vsed a few erebus recently, that have been almost impossible to kill. They evade too much, move to fast, stack health alot. with all that goignon he still moves fast, so i dunno wtf items they get. So i decided to do an evasive build myself, man was that was a failure and a half.

but i dont think he needs to be nerfed. ppl have just found his highest potential. time to do so for the rest.

Ryan is a real @#^%% with erb isn't he...

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 13, 2009 12:00:49 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

The problme is that the game is so balanced that a minion erebus is powerful early on.

After you start getting upto some decent levels, with accompanying skills and items, you realise it is not that powerful.

The trick is to be wary early on, and not die too much early from it. The slippery slope from dying heaps is where you think it is op, but this is in any situation.

p.s. if they aren't putting a point into mist get a parasite egg. Or upgrade your tower damage and hp.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
Stardock Forums v1.0.0.0    #108432  walnut2   Server Load Time: 00:00:00.0000938   Page Render Time:

Stardock Magazine | Register | Online Privacy Policy | Terms of Use

Copyright © 2016 Stardock Entertainment and Gas Powered Games. Demigod is a trademark of Gas Powered Games. All rights reserved. All other trademarks and copyrights are the properties of their respective owners. Windows, the Windows Vista Start button and Xbox 360 are trademarks of the Microsoft group of companies, and 'Games for Windows' and the Windows Vista Start button logo are used under license from Microsoft. © 2012 Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. All rights reserved. AMD, the AMD Arrow logo and combinations thereof are trademarks of Advanced Micro Devices, Inc.