The Forums Are Now Closed!

The content will remain as a historical reference, thank you.

Star Wars: The Old Republic Discussion Thread

By on December 18, 2011 9:19:57 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums


Join Date 02/2008

Just thought I'd get this going and then weigh in sometime soon.  I picked it up and, so far, absolutely love it.  My first character is a Sith Juggernaut Warrior.  I love how its really story driven and the huge amount of voice acting.  I also dig how crafting is setup.  Anyway, all the time I'm going to put into this post for now... back to playing

Thought I'd update this with some useful info instead of having to dig through the thread.

Clan info, servers, etc.

Many of us are on the Kass City server - includes many SD staffers + folks from the community

  • pacov (pacov)- Bounty Hunter - mercenary (dps) - level 50
  • pewpewpacov - Imperial Agent - sniper (dps) - level 30ish
  • ryat (ryat) - Bounty Hunter - power tech
  • carbon (Ryden) - Sith Assassin
  • seamw (Ahblaka) - imperial agent

Ryat has several other character on Hyperspace Cannon server:

Ryat - Sentinel
Ryata - Gunslinger
Tayme - Sage
Zachy - Commando


Locked Post 311 Replies
Search this post
Subscription Options

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 26, 2012 4:15:36 PM from JoeUser Forums JoeUser Forums

Quoting lulapilgrim,
For me, the game with its enabling participation in violence and sexual vice is good for no one..not for the single person, not for the married person and certainly not for children of any age. 

Quoting pacov,
Yes, but if you draw that comment out to its logical conclusion, then you are pretty much saying that any game that has violence, etc, is not a good thing.  We have a disagreement if that is your stance.  I'm sure we could get into the nitty gritty of it, but I'm curious if that's your overall belief. 

For me, sexual vice is never good at any time. Not in life, not in gaming. Period. 

As far as violence, 

I understand that in some cases, violence is in self-defense or in just war. So, I'm OK with games that depict violence in those situations. 

Other than that, violence for violence sake or "entertainment" is never good. 

Below is a 2006, article by Rebecca Hagelin that I think is worth bringing into the discussion. It's entitled, "Video Games, violence and our sons".  


 “Life is like a video game. Everyone has to die sometime.”

If you spent part of your youth playing “Pac-Man” and “Space Invaders,” such a statement must seem bizarre. Video games were … well, games -- innocent diversions that did nothing worse than eat up dotted lines and too much of our allowances. A waste of time? Perhaps. But nobody got hurt.

At least, they didn’t used to.

The opening statement above was spoken by Devin Moore, a teenager who murdered three people -- two police officers and a 911 dispatcher -- in a Fayettesville, Ala., police station in 2003. Arrested on suspicion of car theft, Moore was brought in for booking and ended up on a bloody rampage.

He lunged at Officer Arnold Strickland, grabbed his gun and shot him twice. Officer James Crump, who responded to the sound of the gunfire, was shot three times. And before he ran outside with police car keys he snatched, Moore put five bullets in Dispatcher Ace Mealer. Was this the first time Moore had committed such a heinous crime? Yes and no.

Moore was a huge fan of a notorious video game called Grand Theft Auto. As the title suggests, the goal is to steal cars. If that’s all there was to the "game" it would be bad enough, but it gets worse: the way to acquire and hold on to the cars is to kill the police officers who try to stop you. And the sick minds behind the game give you plenty of choices -- shooting them with a rifle, cutting them up with a chainsaw, setting them on fire, decapitation.

If you shoot an officer, you get extra points for shooting him in the head. It's no surprise, then, that all of Moore’s real-life victims had their heads blown off.

According to court records, Moore spent hundreds of hours playing Grand Theft, which has been described as “a murder simulator.”

But this time, his victims weren’t a collection of animated pixels on a TV screen. They were flesh-and-blood human beings whose lives were snuffed out in seconds. They had families who continue to mourn their loss -- such as Steve Strickland, Officer Strickland’s brother. Tomorrow, he will testify before the U.S. Senate Judiciary Committee’s Subcommittee on the Constitution, Civil Rights and Property. Chaired by Sen. Sam Brownback, R-Kan., the purpose of the hearing is to examine the constitutionality of state laws regulating the sale of ultra-violent video games to children. Three psychologists will testify about the potential link between playing violent video games and copycat violence, and whether the games contribute to aggressive behavior.

With the ever-expanding use of technology by our children, such hearings are critical. We must determine if Moore and other murderers like him are anomalies or if ultra violent video games dangerously warp the psyches of our youth. Those tempted to scoff at the connection between video games and behavior should bear a couple of things in mind. First, video games are not passive or spectator media. While playing the game, teenage boys and young men, the largest users of video games, actually become the characters who cut up their victims with chainsaws, set them on fire, or chop off their heads.

According to Dr. Elizabeth Carll of the American Psychological Association (who also will testify tomorrow), this active participation enhances the “learning” experience. And video games are often played repeatedly for hours on end -- so, hour after hour, teens playing games such as Grand Theft Auto “learn” how to kill police officers and earn points for their barbarianism.

The second fact to keep in mind is that teenagers’ brains are still developing and are extremely impressionable. The parents of teens hardly need reminding that for all their joys, teens often lack judgment, critical thinking skills and foresight.

Some are better than others, yes, but many (like Moore) are startlingly deficient. In short: Put a “murder simulator” in their hands, and you just might be asking for trouble. But don’t put words in my mouth – I am not saying that every kid that plays a violent video game will become a criminal.

And as a staunch conservative who believes that “the government that governs least governs best,” I’m not advocating a plethora of laws that may have a chilling effect on free speech. I do, however, recognize that it is sometimes necessary to provide special protections for minors from harmful materials - take pornography and alcohol, for example. As a mother, I also believe that our nation must examine how the products of our toxic culture affect the civility and safety of our children and of our society. We owe it to the students who died at Columbine; we owe it to Devin Moore’s victims; we owe it to our own children.

But armed with the truth, and a God-given mandate to train our own children, we must never depend on government to take care of our kids or raise them. Parents must wake up to the fact that our nation’s boys are being used and manipulated by an industry making billions of dollars by warping their minds. As I outline in my book, Home Invasion: Protecting your family in a Culture that's Gone Stark Raving Mad, it doesn’t take an act of Congress to take back your home -- it takes active, loving, informed parenting. It takes setting boundaries and sticking with them. It takes understanding our kids, and understanding that our kids need us to guide them. Senator Brownback is taking a bold step and doing his job as an elected official in exploring the effects of video game violence - it's up to parents to use the information to protect our sons and our society.



Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 26, 2012 6:19:07 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Classic bait and switch.  Bioware/EA probably planned this from the beginning as MMOs desperately need the initial sales and user base after such a large investment.  They just didn't want to risk SWtor losing potential sales like how GTA's porn patch did until after the product was already sold to unwitting customers.  I'm disgusted how any business can pull shenanigans and just jerk people around like this. 


Customers here have a legitimate right to be upset.  If this was a normal single player game that is not online it wouldn't be quite so severe because the patch would not be forced and an online connection (usually) is not required to play.  However it is an online MMO.  When you purchased the product Bioware specifically said on the website there will not be any content of that nature as it is not in the Starwars universe.  Now they do a complete 180 after initial sales and you get a different product.  By choice you can not use the same product you purchased without some sort of extreme hack that as far as I know does not exist.


It's a bit shocking how here on Stardock, home of the Gamer Bill of Rights, so many users overlook, support, and defend EA/Bioware for this underhanded practice. Who woulda thunk?  For that matter, I'm shocked EA can play so recklessly with company assets.  The Bioware brand name has been systematically tied to every EA studio and if one tarnishes the image they all suffer.


Best advice I can give would be to first demand a refund on the grounds of bait and switch, plus contact the company about the potential lack of possibility of any future dealings.  When refused, then file with the Better Business Bureau.  The BBB extends both to the US and Canada.  Next, aggressively inform other users and their parents.  When enough are gathered a class action lawsuit can be feasible.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 26, 2012 6:50:01 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

A bait and switch, are you serious? Unless this game was sold catering specifically to the homophobe crowd, promising that no matter what, homosexuality would never be in any way included (unless maybe one of the antagonists, just one more reason to dislike them right?), you have no case. Keep dreaming.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 26, 2012 7:03:50 PM from Stardock Forums Stardock Forums


@ lulapilgrim


Don't the gun nuts in the US say something along the lines of "guns don't kill people........people kill people"?   Well then by the same token wouldn't it be "video games (even the violent ones) don't kill people.........people kill people".   You can't have it both ways.

Also don't get me started on what you called just war.  There is no such thing.  If you truly believe in god (and the god who has been completed by the new testament) then there is no such thing.  War is still murder [ a rose is a rose........]



Assigning blame in life is always a tricky sitiuation and especially so when it goes to finding someone guilty of a crime.  To find a videogame the cause of someone's violent outburst not only removes culpability from the offender it also marginalises the victims because if someone/something else is always to blame for someone not behaving according to generally accepted sociatal structure then they simply become victims of circumstance and not the criminal's whim.

Violent video games may contribute to the inurement of persons toward violence (which would go to their capability or willingness to feel remorse for violent actions) but I wholeheartedly disagree that that would in fact ever be the cause of same violent action(s).




Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 26, 2012 7:25:58 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Anyone care to discuss the game? I would seriously like to know how people are finding PVP. I am having trouble justifying sinking credits into something like that.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 26, 2012 11:03:15 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

I am not much of a PvP player but I enjoy it. Having never done other MMOs I can only give what I see with SWTOR. Its easy to queue up for it as after lvl 10 you can just use the little button at the lower right of the map to indicate you want to play no matter where you are. The Hutt Ball arena is a bit of a pain to learn but the other two arenas are not bad. The new arena being added in 1.2 is really fun IMHO. A definite twist on the "capture the control points" concept. When you hit lvl 50 the learning curve gets steep (especially when facing ones with high level gear) but 1.2 tries to fix that with gear you can buy (though still not as good as what you can earn by playing and winning) and a ranking system but I haven't been able to try that out yet.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 27, 2012 12:09:13 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

won't be able to reply the next couple days, but reading.  cya.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 27, 2012 1:16:37 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums
Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
March 28, 2012 2:46:59 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

First Part


Hmm. Part of that article makes an interesting point.


Many nations have laws banning the advertisement and marketing of youth (especially small children), yet such laws are not in place in the US.

Not just video games, but fast food, cereal, toys, etc.

Marketing towards youths should be severely limited if not outright banned.


As far as video games go, there will always be troubled individuals. However Japan may well be proof that a nation that lives vicariously will tend to have a lower crime rate, although there are many other considerations to factor into their crime rate ... such as Confucian ideals, harsher penalties, and a nearly homogenous culture.

I certainly think that Corporate interests should be hindered, at least when it comes to children, although as to the content of games ... I am not sure that we have the right to alter or limit the content of such games, merely to limit/hinder/regulate their marketing and advertisement (if they fall into a category of "adult" themed game specifically marketed towards young teens, preteens and below)


second part

I think the fact that the teen in question was being brought in for some routine questioning, and his rather extreme outburst, is indicative of a paranoid, low self esteem individual who does not fully know the extent of his own rights.

I should not think the blame should be deflected from him in any way. Regardless of what he might have thought he learned from a video game, successful real world application of some skills seems indicative that this was not truly his first time shooting a gun, and may have not been his first instance of illegal behavior either. Usually those that would kill a uniformed officer is someone that has either had a spontaneous mental break, or they have killed before.

Therefore it is my belief that he had already killed (in real life) in cold blood, and was so paranoid that he felt the need to kill multiple officers at a police station; in a situation where he had no reason to be violent whatsoever. In other words he was already a killer, and he overestimated in this situation and freaked out. I doubt a non-killer could have pulled that off while freaking out, imho. Only someone with a bit of experience.


As far as video games are being related to violence, I am of the opinion that they do not by themselves increase or decrease violent crime (necessarily), but they change the way that violent crime is viewed.

US Special Operatives in Somalia during the early 1990s felt that the operations were "as taking part in a movie", while today's soldiers likely feel that they are in a video game.

This then has the potential to remove the seriousness of the situation for the participants, and allows all violent men (both professional and criminal) to take needless risks. This then is the real danger of violence in mass media ... not an increased violence among civilians, but an increased recklessness in the men that are already violent.


That is all.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
June 4, 2012 4:42:21 PM from JoeUser Forums JoeUser Forums

Obviously a necro, but its not really worth creating a new topic imo.

Star Wars: The Old Republic getting free-to-play update to level 15, new content

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
June 4, 2012 4:47:13 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Coming with the 1.3 update.


Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
Stardock Forums v1.0.0.0    #101114  walnut1   Server Load Time: 00:00:00.0000172   Page Render Time: