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pacov's League of Legends general discussion thread - strategies, etc

By on November 29, 2011 1:07:18 PM from JoeUser Forums JoeUser Forums

pacov

Join Date 02/2008
+183

I've locked/archived this thread/blog and have started a new discussion over here:  https://forums.demigodthegame.com/454943/

Please join me if you like.

 

 

 


 

 

Am I streaming


 

 

Well, I started a thread  back in August (http://forums.joeuser.com/411269/) that's seen a lot of activity and actually had quite a few good bits of information for new and old players alike.  I figure it's time to start a new thread and perhaps keep the OP up-to-date with useful information, etc.  Feel free to use this post for any LoL discussion, etc.

Super fast background:  I played a lot of Demigod as pacov/cheesuscrust.  Back in August 2011 or so, I started getting heavily involved in LoL and folks have been kind enough to chime in with tips and links to various sites that have been quite useful to me.  In addition, I've been able to keep up with folks that I've played Demigod with in the past and meet some new folks that play LoL and frequent these message boards. 

Here's some of the things I've learned in the previous thread:

 New Player tips

  • Play the tutorial.
  • Consider picking up the starter bundle.  It's 530 RP (that's about $4).  You get 8 champs unlocked, a 4 win IP boost and a 10 win XP boost.  It's a pretty good deal (used it recently on an alt account).  You can find it in the game store under bundles.
  • Riot gives you 400 RP as soon as you hit level 5.  It's enough to buy some skins, a boost, or a cheap character. 
  • Learn to last hit!  Last hitting is simply landing the last hit on creeps.  If you last hit, you get gold for that kill.  The number of creeps you have killed is tracked in a value called CS.  You can see this number in the top right hand corner of the ui or by pressing tab.  Here's a really simple tutorial re: last hitting if you are brand new - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LheiRB76x5g
  • Read some guides on any character you want to try out.  The recommended builds (what you see when you go to a shop) are not optimal.  The guides include item suggestions and skill orders.  These are very useful in learning decent ways to build characters
  • Use the rune combiner to get level 3 runes prior to level 20 if you like.  You will need 375 IP.  Buy any tier 1 rune that costs 15 IP.  You need to purchase 25 of these.  Click on your rune page.  In the bottom right hand corner there is a button called the Rune Combiner.  If you place 5 runes in there, you can get a random rune that is 1 tier higher (eg if you have 5 tier 1 runes, you will get 1 random tier 2 rune.  Anyway, the math works out such that you spend 375 IP ( buy 25 tier 1 15 IP runes) and you get 1 completely random tier 3 rune.  Some of the quintessences are 2k IP, so if you luck out and get one of those, you just won the lottery.  You can always keep the random tier 2 rune if you end up with something good and don't want to trade it out yet.
  • Consider setting aside IP for tier 3 runes (available at level 20 and above).  You can't purchase them with real money - only IP.  Keep that in mind.

Great site I visit every day for LoL related news - http://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends

pacov's misc info

Here's a guide I made

pacov's Guide to Improving at League of Legends and Moving Up in Elo

k - so I'm just going to put down some of my thoughts.  I'm not amazing at this game, but I do certain things that improve my odds of winning in ranked and so far its panning out just fine (bronze 5 to gold 5 in about a month or so).  We all have varied skill levels, so some of this might be useful and some not.  Caveat complete.

Prerequisite- you need to know how to play every single role.  You don't have to be a god at every single role (more power to you if you are - I'm certainly not).  You need to be able to play at a serviceable level in every single role and excel at least at 1 role (preferably 2).  In my case, I'm good at support and adc.  I'm not great, but have serviceable mids and jungles and so so tops.  Knowing what you are good at and bad at is very important.  If you don't know, I can probably tell you - but you really should know...  Anyway, you need to have enough champs to make solid picks in any role and you need to be able to cover any role if it comes down to it.  I'll talk about how to get better at specific roles in a bit.

Champ select advice - Don't be the "fill" guy unless you really feel like you are awesome in all roles.  Call your preferred role immediately when you hit the lobby.  Say "adc pref."  Do this as soon as you hit the lobby.  Some people believe that if you call a role you magically get it.  This is stupid, but if you call something out, folks will often accomodate your request.  If you are feeling wishy washy for whatever reason, call out multiple roles in order of what you want to play - "adc/mid pref."  In my experience, you generally do not want to call support.  It's a very important role, but you want to be in a position to carry every single game if possible.  If you aren't calling out a role, you are hoping that other players can carry you.  If you are hoping that folks will carry you, you don't deserve to win.  You need to know your best roles and you absolutely should request them.

Solo or duo in ranked? - Well, my 1st thought here is that you should solo.  If you solo, you have to rely on yourself.  IMO - its a much bigger test of skill to play solo and win than to duo.  Do you want someone to carry you or do you really want to know that you are actually good?  That said, provided you have the right duo partner, you can increase your odds of winning quite a bit.  The simple math is that instead of having 4 teammates as unknown quantities, you only have 3.  If you have a good duo teammate, you know what you can expect.  When you duo, you get the most bang for your buck by having complimentary roles.  Support/adc is good; jungle/mid also works.  Even if you don't have direct symmetry in roles, if you are an amazing mid and I'm an amazing adc, our odds go up quite a bit if we both get those roles.  Our odds go way down if we can't get those roles and are forced to play out of positions that we are weaker.  For example, Bryff is a good mid.  If he duo's up with me, the only way he will get to play that role is for me to call mid, take it myself, and then put myself into a position like support where I can't carry out of (I'm always 1st pick, Bryff is always last pick when we duo)... that and I have to show the mid I'm picking at the start which means Bryff gets hard countered.  In short, we can expect that we will be a disadvantage when duo queuing.  Now, if Bryff queued up with someone at a lower elo than himself that was solid, he'd likely be 1st pick and be able to get mid and have a better chance of carrying the game.  Anyway, you need to keep in mind where you end up in pick order when duoing if you aren't looking to go adc/support.  If you want that, you can usually get it. 

How do you get better in roles that you are not good at? - Well, here's what I do.  And this is really what I do on a regular basis.  I think about what I'm good at and what I'm not good at.  For instance, I realized that I don't play any hyper carry ads.  So, I read up on hyper carries like vayne and kog maw.  I look for guides on how to build them (most adcs are the same btw ), I look for vids on how people play them (eg how do I all in with a specific champ - is there a combo - when do I all in - what's the best way for me to burst - how should I behave in lane with this champ).  Then, I fire up a custom game and try out the mechanics of whatever champ vs AI.  Usually I learn a few tricks during that custom on how to position myself, etc.  Then, I'm off to normal games where I'll request the role or character I'm trying out.  Now, people still report your for being awful in normals, but it really is where you need to try out characters to see if you are any good or not as the bots are useless for proving your skill level to yourself.  So, fire up that normal and ask to play a role (again - after you've tried out the champ against bots).  If you don't know anyone you are with and you are quite awful, I suggest muting everyone at the start of the game.  Then, do your best.  Continue with this until you feel like you have a serviceable skill level in whatever role.  And keep in mind what you need to work on.  For me, I noticed I didn't really have alot of mids for ranked, so I started practicing some with gragas against and karth.  That way, I'll be able to get the job done if I need to play mid.  The next thing I need to do is put more time into being better top lane. Again, because while I prefer adc/support, I might need to play top for the team.  So, best to be ready for it.  Put your time in and practice roles. 

One last thought - there are certain things you can generally expect in ranked.  1 - if you are 1st pick, you generally can call whatever you want.  Common knowledge, I'm sure - but I'll add - CALL WHATEVER YOU WANT.  2 - if you duo queue, you generally can lock down both adc and support.  It works best if your adc is 1st pick, ofc.  I've bumped into like 10 random dedicated supports in all of my games of LoL.  People generally aren't going to call support. So, if you are 1st pick and duo'd, just call adc and then your duo partner can almost always get support.

 

Lol King profiles for ranked tracking

I'm not going to update this regularly, so just consider it a snapshot (I'll add a date when I update them).  Anyway, I enjoy seeing folks progress through ranked and keeping tabs on that sort of thing from time to time. 

Snapshot updated 05/28/2014

 Character guides

Mid Ziggs by cow - http://www.lolking.net/guides/7906
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June 16, 2013 12:10:00 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting Koskee,
EDIT: @pacov... I'm really happy that clip exists and will listen to it every time I am in a promotion series.

Make a ring tone. 

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June 16, 2013 12:21:11 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Some changes on PBE for leblanc - snipped this all from reddit

 

Sigil of Silence ( Q ) mana cost lowered to 50/60/70/80/90 from 70/75/80/85/90. 
Sigil of Silence ( Q ) initial damage lowered to 55/80/105/130/155 ( +.5 AP ) from 70/110/150/190/230 ( +.6 AP )
Sigil of Silence ( Q ) mark trigger damage increased to 55/85/105/130/155 ( +.5 AP) from 20/40/60/80/100 ( +.3 AP )
Sigil of Silence ( Q ) silence reduced to 1.5 at all ranks from 2

Distortion ( W ) mana cost increased to 80/90/100/110/120 from 80/85/90/95/100.

Ethereal Chains ( E ) cooldown increased to 14/13/12/11/10 from 10 at all ranks
Ethereal Chains ( E ) time to trigger shackle decreased to 1.5 from 2.
Ethereal Chains ( E ) shackle time changed to 1.5 at all ranks from 1/1.3/1.6/1.9/2.2 seconds.

Mimic ( R ) now has different flat damages for each of LeBlancs spells.
Mimicked Sigil of Silence and Ethereal Chains deal 100/200/300 (+0.65 AP) magic damage on both instances of their damage.
Mimicked Distortion deals 150/300/450 (+ratio missing ) magic damage.

Mimic ( R ) mana cost reduced to 0 from 100/50/0.

This is actually a huge buff for her since you were forced to max Q and only use Q>R in succession since mimic used your spell's rank for damage calculation. Also, her W>R damage got increased by roughly 30% which might alleviate her late game problems some what. (Her W>R will do roughly 50% more damage than Annie's bear drop with 500 AP, giving her much needed aoe damage.)

Her post 6 harass is going to be so retarded with a zero mana cost R.

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June 16, 2013 12:45:24 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

I just know Yoshi from another friend, he's 10 and I think league will have a bad influence on him

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June 16, 2013 4:31:35 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

random comment - so, nunu and spell vamp.  You go the jungle item with SV - that's 20% heal off a fully leveled consume - so you get 1000 dmg x 20% = 200 hp.  Add that to the base and its a heal for about 500-600 hp ever consume.  Now, get another sv item.  I think I was goofing off with what actually seemed a semi reasonable build and had 60% sv with a consume every 4-5 seconds.  So, I'm getting heals there for 400 or so normal + the sv bonus... anyway, it anywhere between 800 hp -1100 hp every single consume.   The way I built it I had aegis and whatever the tanky mana item is (720 armor item + blue mana + combine cost = item im talking about).  Anyway, the trick to incredibly easy baron steals is in the spell vamp.  Just in my dicking around game, I very easily hit a 15 min baron with minimal items/kills as well.  Anyway, its quite strong. 

Now, in a team fight, here's where is slumps off a bit.  You actually need to have things to consume... and everyone typically aoe clears creeps.  Its actually optimal to not dmg the creeps and let nunu tank a tower with the setup.  The moment you kill the creeps, he can't consume and the novelty is gone.  So if he was going to be an effective tank, you'd literally have to choose not to actively clear creeps out... anyway, theory crafting nonsense.  You can also do a less rediculous version of this build with just the base 20% sv and play a more traditional nunu... that can still solo baron at 15. 

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June 16, 2013 8:28:30 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

I thought spell vamp was unique on items and didn't stack??

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June 16, 2013 9:08:37 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting Bryff,
I thought spell vamp was unique on items and didn't stack??

well... every item I bought it on did stack.  I checked the % sv as I went and got to 60%.  That was the % I exected to see based on what I built.

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June 17, 2013 1:12:45 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

http://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/1gh3op/analyzing_every_champion_in_the_game_as_early/

worth a look imo - I believe its decent analysis, but I didn't have a chance to read all yet - just a quick skim. 

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June 17, 2013 12:22:10 PM from Stardock Forums Stardock Forums

Quoting Krazikarl,

Yes, but you also have to keep in mind that you make a lot of calls based on what you think you know, rather than what you are sure about.  I've been told by you several times that the enemy flash/barrier are down only to show up and have them flash away.

Pacov loves getting ganks from his jungler!  But I'm sure he wasn't just saying that to get a visit from his good buddy Karl...

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June 17, 2013 1:25:20 PM from JoeUser Forums JoeUser Forums

Quoting Thundercles,
But I'm sure he wasn't just saying that to get a visit from his good buddy Karl...

I would never, ever, trick karl into ganking my lane.  Never.  huehuehue.  Nah - but seriously, if I called out something down like barrier/flash, my brain at least thought that crap was down.

So, I created a build over on lolking that I'm working on for mr nunu.  www.lolking.net/guides/155536

I'm still kind of going through refining it.  It's actually pretty effective for soloing baron at the 15-17 minute mark. The thing I like best about the build is that its incredibly versatile after you get the setup you need for baron.  And who doesn't love it when you are in lane and suddenly baron buff pops up on you out of the blue.  Anyway, I played 1 game yesterday where I easily got baron at the 17 min mark, but we still got stomped sadly.  Then I had a second game where I was already kind of pissed off/annoyed where I couldn't go for it because our mid, the only one not in voice chat, decided it was roam top time for no explicable reason... which drew most of the enemy team near baron... and gave up our mid tower.  I was really pissed with our Aatrox.  I have to say, if you don't find Aatrox strong, you are probably doing it wrong.  Guy refused to come mid to defend our inhib because trynd was top and the second outer tower. Never occurred to him that someone else could have held off trynd.... and even if not, he was our only shot at a good initiate or counter to stop us from losing our inhib.  blahblahblah - was in a bad mood by this point in the night, so I was probably just overreacting. 

re: my crashing at load screen problem - I think I have that all sorted now.  It's been several days without any issue, so hopefully that's it.  I'd really like to get LSI installed again as I find that quite useful, but I'm nervous that I'll start getting crashes again and then be randomly SOL not having a clue what the exact problem is.  I'll be brave enough to try it again sometime soon methinks.

 

OK - back to the whole Nunu build and baron steal, I'd like to discuss this a bit more.  Hedgie brought up a concern that I think is a bit of a nonissue for how I run my build.  He said if he saw nunu with the spell vamp jungle item, he'd think that someone is likely out to steal baron.  Well, based on the timing of my build, I'm not seen by the enemy team at 15 minutes and I typically buy that item at 14 minutes or so.  So, you don't see me building that bit.  Personally, I don't think that would be a major tell or at least one that folks would pick up on if they saw me with it, but that's what hedgie was thinking.

Other stuff - is it worth it in you folks mind to go a specific champ like nunu for the early baron?  It takes about 35-45 seconds to solo baron at the 15 minute mark.  You pink out the pit and its at a time when no one is warding baron.  As long as things look normal its pretty easy to sneak it in without someone popping up out of nowhere.  And by normal, I mean that there's not some crazy 4 man gank happening top, etc.  As long as nothing tips the enemy off that you are working over baron.  I've tested this out multiple times (tests are in bot games without getting multiple kills or anything (just 1-2) and its a cake walk between 15-17 min using a pretty cheap build. 

The only downside is that your snowball is weaker during ganks - which means you have lower dps.  We aren't talking a huge difference, but a difference all the same.  I really think its worth it to take nunu for that solo baron option.  Very nice global gold and a huge boost for the whole team at a time when no one is expecting it.  If we coordinated, I folks could setup stuff in their lane to just go nuts the moment the baron buff hit.  Anyway, I tried it twice.  Succeeded easily the 1st time.  The 2nd time I had to break off baron because of some stupid mid roaming could have given the enemy team the baron when they chased our mid away... by the baron pit.  Really did not like that guy... great - nunu is soloing baron - I shall now bring the enemy team to baron.  Kudos. 

 

other stuff - I got some good tips out of you folks re: jungling - thx for that.  One thing I'm working on changing is skipping wraiths for other priorities (be it jungle or gank).  My previous mentality is that its money - get it.  Now I see it as money/xp... just very, very little and not worth it.  So, that's helping my decision making process.  I started playing nocturn yesterday as a jungler.  Went ok for the most part.  Had a couple of really good moves here and there.  Karl made some build suggestions that I'll likely stick to.  Its a diff type of jungler than I'm used to (high dmg).  Usually I just build utility - with noct its all about burst.  I just need to transition better for late game and perhaps get a bit more tanky... and I should only use him in certain compositions.  But he's fun to use.

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June 17, 2013 3:27:37 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Jungle Nunu isn't really about ganking anyway. His job is to put the enemy jungle so far behind that they can't optimally gank or help their team. So if you can do that and get baron at 17, then I think it is fine. I myself like building spellvamp on Nunu in the rare event I play him, but the 500 hp tenacity jungle item is really hard to pass up.

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June 17, 2013 3:43:34 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Karma support has been wondrous in carrying me through these lower-level ranked games, because she deals enough damage to deny inexperienced players farm, and she can provide a strong escape for both herself and her carry. She's also really fun to bait with, just sit there low health and pretend to recall in the middle of the lane... more often than not they'll both flash to get me, and I'll just R+W and we'll pick up a double kill.

 

also jungle invades at level one with W are horrifyingly powerful, as these bronze junglers just sit next to the blue buff with their midlane and whomever else is with them, and I'll just tether one and run in the direction of a possible escape so their resulting flash won't break the tether. I haven't had a game where we didn't get a kill when we invaded.

 

what problems with Karma can you guys see that would prevent me from using her in later leagues?

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June 17, 2013 4:06:57 PM from JoeUser Forums JoeUser Forums

Quoting OMG_Shiro,
500 hp tenacity jungle item is really hard to pass up.

yeah... the spell vamp on the other one is worth a 500-700 hp heal with consume - IF there are creeps... and there usually are not in a team fight.  You really miss having the extra hp once big fights go down if they get dragged out a bit.  Then again, nunu is actually a split pushing nightmare if he can be off by himself.  You literally just tank the tower nonstop and hit it as long as there is an enemy wave there - so much sustain from the consume + vamp.  Not that his aa's do an insane amount of dmg, mind you...

Quoting CPPFZKrdaxDrkrun,
what problems with Karma can you guys see that would prevent me from using her in later leagues?

Well, she keeps getting buffed.  I haven't seen her win rate % since the last patch (you should take a look on lol king and see where she is at this point).  She has a nice kit and even better sustain, but, at least to me, she's just kind of awkward.  I don't like her as a support or a mid.  She can work both places, but running around with a support kit is less than optimal when team fights happen imo.  I don't know - she just feels off to me.  If you can get it to work for you consistently, though, go for it.  She provides a ton of utility, but no true showstopper ult.  sona has a stun for her ult + aura buffs, janna can displace, leona is a beast for cc.  As a support, her dmg isn't impressive (but you can bait using her during lane like you mentioned pretty effectively), she can only heal herself (supports like her shouldn't generally be getting their arse kicked in a team fight to require a heal for themselves.  And you can only choose 1 option to use with her ult.  For instance, you can't choose to heal yourself in a team fight as the you wouldn't be able to r/q or r/e (which would be more useful for the team than you getting some extra sustain).  It's just kind of clumsy imo.  A support that can only heal themselves - super.  Nice for extra sustain in lane I guess.  This is why I started toying around with her as a tanky top laner.  Then she can initiate and use r/w.  But she's also a clunky top laner.... I just think it's more logical than her as a mid/support based on what she can do.  She has a speed buff that she could use to get to the back lane and then heal up via her snare and then root.  At any rate, she does have ok peels for the adc at least.

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June 17, 2013 4:29:31 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Well, just had a game that we lost...

I don't recommend Ez to lower-level players because they don't seem to play him very well... like teleporting on to a Cait trap, then missing both Q and W, dying, then blaming me for some reason :[

we still got that first-blood jungle invade W. It's OP, I'm tellin ya.

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June 17, 2013 4:49:32 PM from JoeUser Forums JoeUser Forums

Quoting CPPFZKrdaxDrkrun,
we still got that first-blood jungle invade W. It's OP, I'm tellin ya.

that is a good point - reasonable invade potential if you can get the team on board.  solo queue always a little dicy if the support is calling the invade, though. 

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June 17, 2013 9:23:29 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

pacov hits gold IV. 

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June 17, 2013 9:27:30 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

some nerfs over on pbe - kennen gets hit

http://www.reignofgaming.net/news/24662-unofficial-pbe-patch-notes-for-6-17-2013

Kennen

  • Base damage now 47 (down from 51.3)
  • Base HP5 now 4.5 (down from 4.65)
  • [Passive] - Mark of the Storm - Now lasts for 6 seconds (down from 8 seconds)

Nunu

  • Health scaling is now 96 per level (down from 108)
  • [Q] - Consume - Now deals 500/625/750/875/1000 (changed from 600/700/800/900/1000)

nunu gets nerfed, but it does not matter.  Can still baron early as you max q fast enough for same dmg output.  Kind of a dumb nerf imo - does slow him a very little early tho

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June 18, 2013 5:03:01 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

No, that slows down his early clear speeds.  He needed it.  Too easy to gank often and keep your jungle clear at the same time.

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June 18, 2013 8:04:49 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

master yi visual rework looks decent

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June 18, 2013 9:05:48 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

ok - here's my nunu guide.  I spent a little more time updating it - www.lolking.net/guides/155536

 

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June 19, 2013 1:06:05 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Went 4-2 in ranked today. Slowly climbing out of the hole I made for myself. Still working on getting plat this season. I haven't given up yet! 

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June 19, 2013 8:33:55 AM from JoeUser Forums JoeUser Forums

Quoting OMG_ZEX,

Went 4-2 in ranked today. Slowly climbing out of the hole I made for myself. Still working on getting plat this season. I haven't given up yet! 

Get it done, cow!  Quite confident you can make it there. 

 

Did anyone else see the teemo dies twitch channel?  I must have watched it for about 15 minutes before going to bed - quite therapeutic.   Anyway, when riot provides those yearly info graphics, they provide stats on how often teemo dies per minute, etc.  The number is quite high.  Anyway, it appears to be a "live" replay stream and they appear to pull about 30 seconds from current games (saw aatrox in the games, so its live ish).  During that 30 seconds, a teemo is killed.  So, every 30 seconds you see a new teemo death including how he got killed.  Not sure if its a live all the time stream or what they are up to, but I enjoyed it.  Also cool to know that they have the tech setup to be able to do this. Query all games with teemo, isolate games where teemo died recently, and stream 30 seconds including that death.  I find that oddly impressive.  Now to check out that spirit udyr. 

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June 19, 2013 9:31:20 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

They finally put the name cleanse through today. About time.

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June 19, 2013 10:39:26 AM from JoeUser Forums JoeUser Forums

Quoting OMG_Shiro,

They finally put the name cleanse through today. About time.

Now that they waited more than long enough to keep you from getting the name you wanted...

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June 19, 2013 10:41:14 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

I found a new one, but yes I am still angry at them about the delay.

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