The Forums Are Now Closed!

The content will remain as a historical reference, thank you.

Question about UI Mods

By on December 24, 2009 6:13:44 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

I love that the UI mods don't require everyone in the game to have the mods in order to work, that makes them really nice, and I really like the team rollover mods that allow me to see my teammates mana and items.  However, this got me thinking, could someone create a UI mod that allowed them to see the OTHER teams mana and items?  I know that cheating is supposed to be impossible on P2P, but if someone was able to make a UI mod like this that did not require other players to have the mod in order to use it online, that would certainly be cheating.  Anyone know if this is possible?  I sure hope not.

 

Koz

0 Karma | 28 Replies
December 24, 2009 6:44:13 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

I don't think anybody has created a mod like that yet. If they have I hope they will only tell SD/GPG so they can fix the problem. However we can see the enemies gold in Chirmaya's mod, not that much of a cheat but still, we shouldn't be able to.

December 24, 2009 10:44:53 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Mana and Items are locked down in the simulation. You cannot retrieve that information.

December 24, 2009 10:58:25 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

You mean you can't retrive that info from enemies?  Because obviously we can retrive that info from teammates.

 

Koz

December 24, 2009 11:17:12 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting Koz1120,
You mean you can't retrive that info from enemies?  Because obviously we can retrive that info from teammates.

 

Koz

Yes. I did a lot of experimentation to discover what can and cannot be done with UI mods. Retrieving information regarding an enemies' items or mana is not in the list of a handful of things you can do that you aren't.

December 25, 2009 10:53:03 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

But you can get the info about their gold...

December 25, 2009 2:43:30 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting abuggeredhedgie,

Quoting Koz1120, reply 3You mean you can't retrive that info from enemies?  Because obviously we can retrive that info from teammates.

 

Koz

Yes. I did a lot of experimentation to discover what can and cannot be done with UI mods. Retrieving information regarding an enemies' items or mana is not in the list of a handful of things you can do that you aren't.

 

Ok, good to know, thanks.

 

Koz

December 26, 2009 3:59:46 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

As a note, the competition League of Legends has this ability built into the game. It would definately change how the game is played since people will not only counter character builds, but would also be able to counter item builds. I agree that if one person has the mod and the other players don't it is pretty much cheating. But one could also say anyone can install UI mods.

December 27, 2009 2:14:00 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Actually, the work I have done...suggests a UI only mod could go as far as to remapping the entire game on your side, allowing the modding of every single file.

Now, you wouldn't be able to do anything that desyncs the game, but there really isnt all that much that does.

I told both Frogboy and Sorian about an issue I found worse than just seeing what items the enemy has, and both have ignored me, and there appears to be no work to try and fix it.

I am currently considering releasing more details about my mod/hack to the public, which might spur them into action. The problem is that DG can't really afford to lose any more people.

December 27, 2009 2:46:14 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

I told both Frogboy and Sorian about an issue I found worse than just seeing what items the enemy has, and both have ignored me, and there appears to be no work to try and fix it.

I am currently considering releasing more details about my mod/hack to the public, which might spur them into action. The problem is that DG can't really afford to lose any more people.
Do NOT do that. Send this issue with detailed information to [email protected] and maybe also send it to -Sorian- via PM on the GPG forum.

December 27, 2009 3:25:06 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting Spooky__,

I told both Frogboy and Sorian about an issue I found worse than just seeing what items the enemy has, and both have ignored me, and there appears to be no work to try and fix it.

I am currently considering releasing more details about my mod/hack to the public, which might spur them into action. The problem is that DG can't really afford to lose any more people.Do NOT do that. Send this issue with detailed information to [email protected] and maybe also send it to -Sorian- via PM on the GPG forum.

indeed, this should only be the last option if some people discover that issue and begin to use it, though most propable its undetectable i guess. however, dont make it public, just spam stardock and gpg with it.

December 27, 2009 11:01:28 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

I've tried contacting them quite a few times. I have yet to even receive a "Hey!". This is why I am starting to consider a more extreme measure...This needs to be looked at, and something done.

December 27, 2009 11:19:07 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

heh.

It being a white hat doesn't work. Go gray.

Play a few games online, post replays. I will willingly lose against you, so it's not classified as cheating or a bannable offense: I agreed and you don't need to give me the mod or details... though I know you have told... other members some details D:

If you still aren't getting the attention it deserveres, go black. If GPG doesn't take the initiative all the "false accusations" about dropping demigod's support then well, they have nothing to fear: they are an upright company. Right?

... Right?

December 28, 2009 1:11:35 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting abuggeredhedgie,
heh.

It being a white hat doesn't work. Go gray.

Play a few games online, post replays. I will willingly lose against you, so it's not classified as cheating or a bannable offense: I agreed and you don't need to give me the mod or details... though I know you have told... other members some details D:

If you still aren't getting the attention it deserveres, go black. If GPG doesn't take the initiative all the "false accusations" about dropping demigod's support then well, they have nothing to fear: they are an upright company. Right?

... Right?

I didn't get a replay, but I did do a game with random people online. I told them I was just testing something, and ended the game as soon as I verified the exploit was working. Currently I am at the parents for christmas, and my laptop can't handle the game, so I can't show you anything/create a new replay. I'll be back jan 1st.

I have only told a single member about it though. Since you know them, you should know how easy it would be to replicate this mod if I even posted the replay though. As soon as someone sees what it is, they would most likely be able to replicate it anyways.

So, yea. I think you can see now how sticky it has become...I've been going over this for several months now:(

Currently, I am thinking when I get back on the first, I will send off another round of messages to support, sorian, frogboy, etc to try and get it looked at. Then we can set up a game for a replay if you want.. If another week goes by, post the replay and what the exploit is ( Though not how to do it. Atleast force any exploiters to figure it out themselves. ) and see what happens from there.

My personal recommendation to stardock/gpg: Disable UI only mods until a more appropriate fix can be found ( if 1 can be. )

December 28, 2009 2:47:13 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

I didn't ignore you at all. You said you sent it to Stardock as well which is the only reply I could have given you. Until Stardock decides how they want to approach this problem there is nothing I can do.

December 28, 2009 3:26:47 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting -Sorian-,
I didn't ignore you at all. You said you sent it to Stardock as well which is the only reply I could have given you. Until Stardock decides how they want to approach this problem there is nothing I can do.

Thanks for replying now. I do understand if there is nothing you can do, however: I would have appreciated a reply sooner along these lines. On my end, receiving no reply at all, appears the same as ignoring me. I will continue to hope Stardock can help out now then.

Again, thanks for the reply.

December 28, 2009 4:02:48 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Just tell us what it does.

December 28, 2009 4:38:16 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting lifekatana,
Just tell us what it does.

It's a very straightforward tweak. ( I did run into it trying to do another mod. ) If I said what it did, it would take people probably less than an hour to figure it out and make their own:( This is why I have been so reluctant to say anything about it so far.

December 28, 2009 4:40:34 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting zechio,

Quoting lifekatana, reply 16Just tell us what it does.

It's a very straightforward tweak. ( I did run into it trying to do another mod. ) If I said what it did, it would take people probably less than an hour to figure it out and make their own:( This is why I have been so reluctant to say anything about it so far.

I'm assuming that our mutual friend told you what I figured out you could do as well...?

Not that I do of course D:

January 4, 2010 9:22:02 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

You do know that it was Christmas vacation and people do have lives right?

January 5, 2010 12:00:02 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting Frogboy,
You do know that it was Christmas vacation and people do have lives right?

Original set of messages "Sent Dec 2, 2009 6:14 AM", along with the forum post: https://forums.demigodthegame.com/370622 at "December 2, 2009 1:54:09 PM" and a reply to your dev. journal https://forums.demigodthegame.com/371755 kindly reminding you of the PM at "December 15, 2009 7:00:49 PM".

Sorry, but it was not Christmas on December 2nd, and I'm pretty sure you were around on the 15th since you posted that dev journal then.

I didn't save the first email I sent to support, but the second one I do have which is still open, but that is entirely expected because of the christmas vacation. ( I did get a pseudo response on it...it has been forwaded to the dev team. )

I did not send any of the second set of messages until the second of this month for the very reason of christmas break.

Finally, being as you just replied here...you do appear to be back, and yet you have not in any way responded to my PM. I'm not asking for it to be fixed or anything now, just a simple "Hey, I don't think that should be happening. We are looking into it now"

January 5, 2010 9:35:47 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Zechio, I got literally thousands of emails a week and hundreds of private messages a day. I don't even have time to begin reading them all let along responding to them all.

If you want these sorts of things addressed, you do have to go through the actual official channelers which you did eventually -- support which in turn forwarded to the development team where it was put on their schedule.

I have asked GPG to look into seeing if they can protect the game from malicious mods even if it means having to eliminate mod support entirely (which is an option). 

I can't speak for GPG but I know we have little intention of spending time and money fighting malicious mods. If mods turn out to be a problem, they'll be eliminated entirely.  Not enough people care about mods to justify the potential of mods ruining the online game experience through griefing. It makes a lot more sense to get rid of them than to spend engineering hours chasing the latest mod exploit.

Is that a good enough answer for you?

 

January 5, 2010 12:02:30 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

That was more than I expected, thank you very much Frog.

I just wanted to mention, if it comes down to just removing them, would it be possible to only remove the UI only functionality? While I don't want to see them go because of their usefulness, I agree with you: If they are a problem with exploiting, they should be removed. I would REALLY hate to see mod support having to be dropped entirely...especially with the many many late nights I spent on it already:(

Also, if I any of us modders can find a way to stop the various exploits, would it be possible for GPG to get that into the game, or would that be a waste of our time?

Thanks for your time!

January 5, 2010 12:54:23 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

What would happen is we'd just have to remove modding period in all likelyhood. The game would do a CRC check and fail to load if it the python scripts loaded didn't match.

If someone can find a way to stop an exploit and help us on that, that's terrific.

 

January 5, 2010 2:08:54 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting Frogboy,
What would happen is we'd just have to remove modding period in all likelyhood. The game would do a CRC check and fail to load if it the python scripts loaded didn't match.

If someone can find a way to stop an exploit and help us on that, that's terrific.

 

Dang, thats bad news:( I really love modding, and the only real potential for exploiting is when one person has a mod the others dont ( IE UI only ).

I will begin looking into various possible fixes for the issues I found, and see about getting ahold of others that have found problems and look for solutions to those as well. I think mine might be a fairly simple thing to fix, but we shall see.

January 5, 2010 10:20:50 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

"

Zechio, I got literally thousands of emails a week and hundreds of private messages a day. I don't even have time to begin reading them all let along responding to them all."

And yet you've made 2 posts already saying that you aren't a troll? I mean. If like, literally 80% of your PMs consisted of a subject header "DIE YOU TROLL" that would make more sense but still... you took the time to read those. That said, it is easy to lose one PM in the masses.

Finally, zechio is talking respectfully and has been a contributor to the forum. I don't understand why you're having such an impatient and curt tone ("Is that a good enough answer for you?" "that's terrific") when it's clear he ISN'T being disrespectful and doesn't really want to release the mod: he just wants someone to respond and he'll do what he needs to do so.

It's not like he is your subordinate or anything like that nor is he some 12 year old on the internet trying to cause trouble. He's a contributor and even if you don't feel that way, he has improved this game.

Stardock Forums v1.0.0.0    #108435  walnut2   Server Load Time: 00:00:00.0000297   Page Render Time:

Stardock Magazine | Register | Online Privacy Policy | Terms of Use

Copyright ?? 2012 Stardock Entertainment and Gas Powered Games. Demigod is a trademark of Gas Powered Games. All rights reserved. All other trademarks and copyrights are the properties of their respective owners. Windows, the Windows Vista Start button and Xbox 360 are trademarks of the Microsoft group of companies, and 'Games for Windows' and the Windows Vista Start button logo are used under license from Microsoft. ?? 2012 Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. All rights reserved. AMD, the AMD Arrow logo and combinations thereof are trademarks of Advanced Micro Devices, Inc.