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Demigod: Weekend status

By on April 17, 2009 11:11:14 PM from JoeUser Forums JoeUser Forums

Well, what a dramatic week it’s been. The teams at Stardock and GPG have been burning the midnight oil this week.

As those of you who have the game can already see, the server issues are gone. We’ve recreated a duplicate of the server infrastructure we had but dedicated to users who have the most recent version of the game and a valid CD key (serial #).

Based on the logs, we are seeing lots of games being played on-line now.  Yay. Average game has approximately 4.7 humans in it which is a good sign.

Some clarifications

I’ve seen a lot of news articles this week and a lot of confusion about what occurred this week. The issue isn’t terribly complicated.

Ars Technica had a good article that describes what happened.  But still, a lot of people seem to think warez users are able to play multiplayer games. No, they can’t.  Even the retail box has a serial # in it that users have to use and be validated to play online.  What brought down servers was a lot more benign than that.  It was the HTTPS requests to inform users if there was a new version along with checking the community features for info (friends lists, chat channels, etc.) and things like that.  Things like that are pretty piddly. It’s only when you get a ton of users doing that at the same time that it becomes a problem as we saw.

But here’s the thing: While piracy is annoying, you can’t blame piracy for this problem. Let’s face it, there’s plenty of data out there about how many pirated games are being played. We should have looked at that.  We assumed since Sins of a Solar Empire and Galactic Civilizations, both of which sold extremely well and got great reviews, that the # of pirated copies of Demigod in use would probably be in the same ballpark, maybe twice as much.  But had we looked at what other publishers have said, we would have known that it’s not unusual for there to be hundreds of thousands of warez copies in use. And if we had, we could have simply had the retail version not have any HTTP calls in it and instead just had an update button on the main menu to check for updates and voila, problem solved.

The second misconception is the argument that because Demigod’s retail version is heavily pirated that it costs massive sales. But that, again, puts the blame on the wrong parties.  If you want to talk about the horrible multiplayer experience on launch day, well, that’s our fault because of what I said above.  If you want to say that the horrible day 1 multiplayer experience resulted in negative game reviews which will seriously damage the game’s sales then I say again, that’s our fault too because of what I said above OR we could have just sent out the review copies on release day (Tuesday) and reviewers wouldn’t have had it until Thursday by which point the problem had largely been resolved and the review scores would have been fine. But in either case, it’s still our fault.

So now what?

Now that the servers are working fine we’re moving away from the “#$R@#@# Demigod sux!” posts and into the regular new game release issues.

So what issues are we seeing and working on? Here are a few at the top of our lists:

1. Players getting disconnected during games.  Demigod’s lag tolerance is fairly low resulting in disconnects if a player lags out a bit. This is fairly easy to fix.  You get a player in Australia playing a user in Europe and there will be times when there’s a hicup in their connection and POW, disconnect and it’s extremely frustrating.  I played all day today and it happened to me.  This is a very high priority.

2. NAT negotiation. For users outside the United States in particular using DSL, this is a problem. This is a case where player A can’t see player B and thus they can’t play together.  This is something we will be aggressively looking at next week. If we hadn’t had the server overload, we likely would have this addressed already.

3. Pantheon games.  Right now, the system is excessively biased for new players – it wants to include AI players as cannon fodder.  While this is fine and dandy for new players, once you know what you’re doing, having AI players in the game is incredibly annoying.  So next week we’re going to change it so that if you have played a few games, it will wean the player off of AI players until you only play humans online. Same for Skirmish.

4. Favor Points and such. There’s some annoying stuff happening with favor points which is related to the ranking system in Demigod as well. First off, we plan to reset the rankings at some point when we enter Epoch 1 (we are in Epoch 0 presently game-wise, I’ll explain Epochs later but in short, every so often we’re going to reset the rankings, save the results as an epoch and go from there).  In Epoch 1, custom games won’t count anymore as there’s too many ways to game it.

5. Misc. Bugs.  There was a crush bug in the game that we’ve fixed internally but it got to be too late in the evening to package it up and get it released tonight.  We have internally fixed the annoying issue of “A ppplayer has left the game” at the start of skirmish and pantheon games. Basically, when you get a new game going, there’s some data that has to be exchanged between players at the start.  But the threshold of time you’re given to do this before it decides you’re too slow is set too low so we’re changing this to be more tolerant. In our tests with players we found on the chat channel who were having problems, it took care of it. 

So that’s what we have in store for next week. After that, we can look at the typical balance requests, cheese stuff, and whatever else crops up.

Now, while the reviews are likely to have a pretty serious impact on sales, it does not affect our plans to continue to release updates and enhancements to the game nor does it affect our plans to release additional free Demigods.

For most of you, have fun this weekend!  For those of you who are having a problem with something, hang in there. We’ve got your back!

 

Draginol is my home account in case people are confused.

Brad "Frogboy" Wardell

+79 Karma | 75 Replies
April 18, 2009 3:30:51 AM from Stardock Forums Stardock Forums

All this whining about the reviews is making me sick.  A game doesn't do well or fail over a several year time frame because of reviews on opening day.  It does well when it is fun and works well (ie not P2P MP games).

April 18, 2009 3:37:33 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Hey great update.. good information.. although unfourantely they just prove my theory all the more... and give me that much more doubt in this game...Fixed SErvers.. everything working.. more updates on the way .... right.. and yet.. 5 hours later.. total meltdown.......kinda reminds me of that movie fun with dick and jane.. where's hes on the news talking up the company.. while its burning to the ground in the backround.. and all the stocks are dropping.. you fixed it.. you melted it to the ground even worse than before.. at least before we could Attempt to join games with the illusion of actaully playing.. now... there's no games.. no pantheon.. (although the 2 games i got in b4 it went down WERE AWESOME!) nothing.. HOLY CHRIST! MAN!! LETS get this togther already!

April 18, 2009 3:46:19 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting XplosivMenace,
Hey great update.. good information.. although unfourantely they just prove my theory all the more... and give me that much more doubt in this game...Fixed SErvers.. everything working.. more updates on the way .... right.. and yet.. 5 hours later.. total meltdown.......kinda reminds me of that movie fun with dick and jane.. where's hes on the news talking up the company.. while its burning to the ground in the backround.. and all the stocks are dropping.. you fixed it.. you melted it to the ground even worse than before.. at least before we could Attempt to join games with the illusion of actaully playing.. now... there's no games.. no pantheon.. (although the 2 games i got in b4 it went down WERE AWESOME!) nothing.. HOLY CHRIST! MAN!! LETS get this togther already!

 

Ahahaha, good comparison.  Not that I am out to get anyone at Stardock or anything, but you are quite right.  I read this topic like five hours ago and an hour after that online just completely died, no games and no connection.  If they already had the dropping issue problem fixed, stay as late as it takes to get it fixed ><.  It is the time of the week now where your game will be played the most.

April 18, 2009 3:52:22 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting Xinoxlx,

1. Deep freeze and Mass charm both giving you cooldowns on skills you weren't even using.

Hm?  Quite sure this doesn't happen.  It inreases cooldown on all recharging skills, not one taht is interupted alone.

I have reported this bug already though back in beta. https://forums.demigodthegame.com/347124/#2147563

April 18, 2009 4:09:34 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Don't suppose you can work on #2 before next week, eh? Would be nice to play a few games this weekend, bonus if I can play with people I know.

April 18, 2009 4:15:21 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

haha ya.. i noticed that today 2.. depp freeze.. hit me while i was sniper planting mines.. hadn't used snipe... randomly have lke 45 sec cooldown on it then.. couple seconds later it was done.. cuz df last 7 or w.e kinda strange.. might be why every1 takes off when i build ice mage and nova rain and freeze lolz

April 18, 2009 4:17:36 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Pity the servers have gone kapuut despite the good update

April 18, 2009 4:39:40 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

These blog posts which you and Frogboy have been posting

Are you aware that Frogboy and Draginol are the same person, Brad Wardell, CEO of Stardock ?

April 18, 2009 5:12:24 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Please add Team support in patheon (arranged teams) and clan support asap! Its one of this small things which are game breaking. Play 500 random team games in WCIII and you know what i mean.

April 18, 2009 6:18:17 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Thanks for the status update. I'm looking forward to some good multiplayer experiences next week

 

The second misconception is the argument that because Demigod’s retail version is heavily pirated that it costs massive sales.

To be honest I pirated the game too. After a few hours playing singleplayer against the AI I decided to purchase the game for the multiplayer part. Besides the connection issues it was total worth the money.

April 18, 2009 6:25:42 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting Project-Dragon,
Thanks for the status update. I'm looking forward to some good multiplayer experiences next week

 


quoting postThe second misconception is the argument that because Demigod’s retail version is heavily pirated that it costs massive sales.

To be honest I pirated the game too. After a few hours playing singleplayer against the AI I decided to purchase the game for the multiplayer part. Besides the connection issues it was total worth the money.

 

So did I. But now i'm starting to regret it because of the server downess.

April 18, 2009 6:31:39 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

piracy.. servers being down... not your fault..everything that gets made will get stolen from someone at some point in time.. it happens.. countermeasure's get put in place.. it still happens everytime..(where there's a will there's a way) so when you come out with a game you understand taht somewhere sum1 iis going to screw you..that still..has no affect on the multiplayer servers being down... now if bad coding... and back doors are allowing piraters to play while using starkdock bandwidth.. then WTfs problem is that.. wouldn't that be once again the problem of the Stardock auth server not being able to decipher hacker/customer?? not the pirate fault.. pirate pirate evevy game.. u think WOW came down cuz you can play it on free servers.... blizzard doens't host the severs!! so how the hell does that in any way affect why the mp is soo fudged now??? no1 2 blame but the creators..pirates will always exisist.. that's why we have coders/programmers to out build more intellegent security/countermeasures... if you built a bank with no guard would your money b safe? isn't it your job to guard the money?? cmon people !!

April 18, 2009 6:41:23 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

I dont understand how they can claim its fixed when i still spent the same amout of time getting a game going as i did before they posted this, and then the servers dieing like this, where the hell is the update on a eta fix? was no one hired to keep them going 24 7? i mean when steam went down for dow2 is was always back up in 5-10m atlest. not many hours later.

April 18, 2009 6:50:40 AM from Stardock Forums Stardock Forums

Thanx for the update. Its why I have been a stardock loyalist for all these years

April 18, 2009 7:25:14 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

The only thing that keeps me "loyal" to Stardock is that they never really screw with the customer.  They stay open and honest about their problems, they don't waste time working on solutions and their games always improve over time.  And usually for a long time after release we enjoy many free updates.

Sins has had a weird success in that it started small and grew slowly after release.  Demigod had a good chance to start big, but has lost some of its momentum with the MP problems and subsequent medicore reviews.  So now SD finds itself in a situation where it needs to engineer the kind of steady growth that Sins enjoyed by keeping Demigod out there on websites.  Make sure gamers know that the game is getting fixed and better.  I think they will still have a successful title, it'll just take a little more PR.

April 18, 2009 7:42:36 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting Ralsar,
The only thing that keeps me "loyal" to Stardock is that they never really screw with the customer.  They stay open and honest about their problems, they don't waste time working on solutions and their games always improve over time.  And usually for a long time after release we enjoy many free updates.

Sins has had a weird success in that it started small and grew slowly after release.  Demigod had a good chance to start big, but has lost some of its momentum with the MP problems and subsequent medicore reviews.  So now SD finds itself in a situation where it needs to engineer the kind of steady growth that Sins enjoyed by keeping Demigod out there on websites.  Make sure gamers know that the game is getting fixed and better.  I think they will still have a successful title, it'll just take a little more PR.

 

I agree with this as well. Although the one thing I do find interesting is I'm noticing Stardock doing a lot more of the replying and tune up w/ patches. I don't think I've heard one statement from a Gas Powered Games developer yet. I guess GPG is busy with Sup Commander 2? Looking foward to future updates, and do please consider pantheon team games!

MP

April 18, 2009 7:55:07 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Thanks for that status update. However...

In Epoch 1, custom games won’t count anymore as there’s too many ways to game it.

NO, NO, NO! DO YOU NOT SEE HOW THIS WILL COMPLETELY SCREW OVER THE GAME IF THE ONLY WAY TO PLAY THE METAGAME IS TO GET THROWN IN WITH A BUNCH OF RANDOM PEOPLE SO THAT ONE CANNOT PLAY WITH ONE'S FRIENDS?

THIS IS NOT THE SOLUTION!

April 18, 2009 8:06:44 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

great post

April 18, 2009 8:15:39 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting scyldSCHEFING,
Thanks for that status update. However...


In Epoch 1, custom games won’t count anymore as there’s too many ways to game it.
NO, NO, NO! DO YOU NOT SEE HOW THIS WILL COMPLETELY SCREW OVER THE GAME IF THE ONLY WAY TO PLAY THE METAGAME IS TO GET THROWN IN WITH A BUNCH OF RANDOM PEOPLE SO THAT ONE CANNOT PLAY WITH ONE'S FRIENDS?

THIS IS NOT THE SOLUTION!

"Top Clans Coming Soon..."

Clans isn't implemented yet as far as I can see. So custom games will probably be used for practice as he is correct its impossible to keep players from gaming it which would turn rankings into a joke.

 

 

April 18, 2009 8:47:35 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

I just spent the night playing an oldy but goodie, Battle for Middle Earth 2.  The online Multiplayer community is still strong even though they completely abandoned it.  Why?  because of several reasons, but most importantly the way the interface works when trying to join a game.

1st off...  when you join the room you dont have to wait to connect to everyone first.  Your in right away, then while you are choosing teams and settings you can chat with the other players.  Also, there is a connections tab.  The host checks to see who is having a hard time connecting.  And if they are not responding to the host well then there is a "kick" button.  Very logical and at the same time builds a community, while waiting on connections you can talk to the other players.  Demigod, well, just does not have this.

2nd...  irc and a friends list?  Wow, is that strange...  Like the EA titles, you have a messenger window where you can "add" friends, see who's online, who is in a current match and on top of that...  you can message them where ever they are.

3rd...  In the main lobby they have stats as to how many people are online, which fraction is being played most and news (which they haven't updated in years)  They could improve on it...  Like Demigod could have stats on the best player of the Day, Week, Month...  Which is the Top Clan (for any online game, this should be one if the top priorities)

4th...  You press Shift Tab... another window pops up...  you press explore and huh...  you visit Impulse Store?  This is prob the lamest thing I have ever seen in a game, ever...  I mean...  you have to run Impulse to update the game right?  Do we really have to have a button trying to sell us more games.  Sad.

5th...  I love the game and it really bothers me that the reviews suck, but I don't blame them.  There is no reason to have a single player mode in the game, because there is NOT one.  And since there isn't a campaign to play and to really enjoy the game you have to play against real people.  Unfortunatly, the game was not ready to launch.  There were many problems in the last beta phase and the connections were poor then and we all waited for 0 day patch to fix everything.   The 0 day patch was another test in my opinion.  The game needed to be rock solid on delivery, the fear now is that how many people will stay and for how long.  If the lobby becomes as empty as Sins (even if its the best RTS on the market) then it will drift off into the sunset.  You got to reel in the fish when they bite, because they most likely wont bite again.

The saving grace to all of this is Frogboy and company behind the game.  For that I will stick with it for a bit and support all of thier titles, because every company should be as open and honest as they are.  In the coming months I feel that they will make changes that will build a large community and not just add more characters into the game.  If you make the game based off of that, then we will all pay a couple of bucks to use new character or whatever to keep the ship going.

April 18, 2009 9:50:13 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

These blog posts which you and Frogboy have been posting are what made me buy the game.
They are both Brad Wardell, Owner, CEO.

April 18, 2009 9:54:52 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting WhopperJr,
I just spent the night playing an oldy but goodie, Battle for Middle Earth 2.  The online Multiplayer community is still strong even though they completely abandoned it.  Why?  because of several reasons, but most importantly the way the interface works when trying to join a game.

1st off...  when you join the room you dont have to wait to connect to everyone first.  Your in right away, then while you are choosing teams and settings you can chat with the other players.  Also, there is a connections tab.  The host checks to see who is having a hard time connecting.  And if they are not responding to the host well then there is a "kick" button.  Very logical and at the same time builds a community, while waiting on connections you can talk to the other players.  Demigod, well, just does not have this.

2nd...  irc and a friends list?  Wow, is that strange...  Like the EA titles, you have a messenger window where you can "add" friends, see who's online, who is in a current match and on top of that...  you can message them where ever they are.

3rd...  In the main lobby they have stats as to how many people are online, which fraction is being played most and news (which they haven't updated in years)  They could improve on it...  Like Demigod could have stats on the best player of the Day, Week, Month...  Which is the Top Clan (for any online game, this should be one if the top priorities)

4th...  You press Shift Tab... another window pops up...  you press explore and huh...  you visit Impulse Store?  This is prob the lamest thing I have ever seen in a game, ever...  I mean...  you have to run Impulse to update the game right?  Do we really have to have a button trying to sell us more games.  Sad.

5th...  I love the game and it really bothers me that the reviews suck, but I don't blame them.  There is no reason to have a single player mode in the game, because there is NOT one.  And since there isn't a campaign to play and to really enjoy the game you have to play against real people.  Unfortunatly, the game was not ready to launch.  There were many problems in the last beta phase and the connections were poor then and we all waited for 0 day patch to fix everything.   The 0 day patch was another test in my opinion.  The game needed to be rock solid on delivery, the fear now is that how many people will stay and for how long.  If the lobby becomes as empty as Sins (even if its the best RTS on the market) then it will drift off into the sunset.  You got to reel in the fish when they bite, because they most likely wont bite again.

The saving grace to all of this is Frogboy and company behind the game.  For that I will stick with it for a bit and support all of thier titles, because every company should be as open and honest as they are.  In the coming months I feel that they will make changes that will build a large community and not just add more characters into the game.  If you make the game based off of that, then we will all pay a couple of bucks to use new character or whatever to keep the ship going.

 

You're a bit of a tart.

 

1) the host does have the ability to boot people who can't connect while they are trying

 

2) What the hell are you talking about? Impulse has the friends list. hit shift-tab to see it. you can message them.

 

3) did you skip over the 'rankings' button?

 

4) Oh, so you mean it's just like steam? lol. yes, it lets you do many things, FOR SHAME.

 

 

April 18, 2009 11:29:17 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

It's funny, some of the reviews being bad I, for a large part, blame the reviewers. I would like to hope any game reviewer knows there are usually some bugs on release day. A game having connection issues? Unheard of!!!! That driving down the review scores the way they have doesn't strike me as reasonable or fair. I've had worse connection issues on launch day, with less reprisal. Knowing that you're working on it should be sufficient for them to at least put off giving the game a condemning score. A caveat is in order in the reviews, but not a quantitative bashing.

April 18, 2009 11:44:01 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting Cerulean_Shaman,
Thanks a lot for the update, glad to hear straight from the team. I'm looking forward to pushing past all this repair stuff and getting on with additional content, but I can wait for the group to get a well deserved rest first,  heh.

 

My  UB pisses me off when it does that! everytime I'm thumping on a Reulus and he floats away on his girly wings my UB stands there doing the Running man unless I click elsewhere.

April 18, 2009 11:47:41 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

o.ô

 

hmmmm

 

Blizzard could learn from posts like that

 

p2p still suxx

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