Cancel Beta account and refund

By Jinx on October 6, 2008 4:56:45 PM from

When the game was first announced, I was quite excited about the possibilities the game would offer and signed up for a pre-order. However, I would now like to cancel that pre-order and get my money back.

I have heard this is not possible. Why is this the case? We have not purchesed a product yet. This is not retail yet, it's beta. All we've done is set aside some money for a product that will eventually be delivered - whether that promise holds true or not. I signed up for pre-order with Beta access as a PERK. I did not pay a full amount just to play a beta game. And now, I no longer want to have a pre-order account.

If we can't get our money back, what security do we have that they'll even deliver a proper finished product? A developer's promise? Pinky swear? Cross your heart and hope to die?

Remember Hellgate? That game's retail release was basically beta quality. People were very upset that what they paid for was a beta product and that they couldn't get their money back. The only difference is that this product actually is officially 'beta' right now. Both games took your money for a beta release.

I have never heard of any company not giving money back for pre-orders, so I am a bit incredulous that Stardock, a company which I thought to be very customer oriented, will not give refunds for pre-orders.

I'm not here to bash the game or anything like that. It's in beta status, I know. There's bugs, missing assets, and a ton of features yet to be implemented. I know. Those aren't the reasons I want a refund, so let's just leave it at that.

Now, with all that out of the way, can I get an official word on the following:

a ) whether or not it's possible to get a refund

b ) if not, why not

c ) is it possible to move the demigod pre-order to another (new) stardock account?

Again, I didn't come here start any flames or to put down the game - just here for information.

+18 Karma | 98 Replies

I really fail to see what the issue is here.

If you don't want to roll the dice, don't preorder--it's not like Stardock is going to run out of copies for Impulse distribution after release. On the other hand, if you've already rolled the dice and you're not happy with how they've rolled, it strikes me as that it's you that doesn't have a leg to stand on. You paid for a Demigod product key, and you've already received that and made use of it.

Quoting Legerdemain,

reply 1

I really fail to see what the issue is here.

If you don't want to roll the dice, don't preorder--it's not like Stardock is going to run out of copies for Impulse distribution after release. On the other hand, if you've already rolled the dice and you're not happy with how they've rolled, it strikes me as that it's you that doesn't have a leg to stand on. You paid for a Demigod product key, and you've already received that and made use of it.

Sounds like someone saying "buyer beware" after you buy a screwed up used car.

No it's not just rolling the dice. You buy a lemon of used cars and there are places to go to force the dealer to correct what they did.

You buy a lemon of used cars and there are places to go to force the dealer to correct what they did.

Lemion laws are not in effect if you know what you are getting. That is not the case here. A buyer is well aware that they are getting a pre-release product.

And yes . . this is a buyer beware issue. The return policy is available online. The buyer could have emailed sales or posted here in the forums before buying.

I think the problem lies in the fact that there's no option to allow user to opt-out of the beta enrollment

Huh? why would there be? Buying into the beta is the same as buying a retail game. Not like you can opt-out after a post-release sale.

The original poster paid for Demigod, not the Demigod beta. The beta was a bonus for promising to buy Demigod when it came out.

And OP will still get Demigod [Retail Version]. Exactly, the beta was a bonus for PROMISING to buy Demigod when it came out. The beta isn't a demo, if you were unsure you should have waited till a demo was out. Why whinge that you can't get 100% back when you commited to buying a product? Just take the 75% refund and be on your way.

Quoting Zubaz,

reply 3

I think the problem lies in the fact that there's no option to allow user to opt-out of the beta enrollment

Huh? why would there be? Buying into the beta is the same as buying a retail game. Not like you can opt-out after a post-release sale.

I think he's talking about the normal pre-order situation, where there's no charge until the game is released. Some people may still want the convenience of a pre-order without wanting to be charged immediately for a beta they're not participating in.

Quoting Asret,

reply 5

I'll ask again what the 'convenience' of preordering is when you're ordering via a download distribution platform. The only thing that could possibly happen at release is that your boxed copy (if you go for that) takes a little bit longer to get to you.

innociv

No it's not just rolling the dice. You buy a lemon of used cars and there are places to go to force the dealer to correct what they did.

If you preorder a game, if they don't charge you until the game ships, and if you don't get to try it before the preorder is charged (as most preorders go), you're in the exact same boat as you are now: you'll already have been charged, and you'll have access to the release game. The only difference here is that you get to be much closer to the development process and they charge you earlier.

How is it fair that someone can just play a game (perhaps not finished but still, playing a game which is 80% done half a year early) for free?
Demo's are made for that purpose, to see if you like it or not.

A beta is a lot more than a demo, and you get free updates + early game play + a say in the final product! Tbh that is worth $45.

And from a pratical point of view what do you want stardock to do? Let everyone play the beta, then if they dont like they just cancel the pre-order and get all their money back and bam - They have just given away one of their partially finished products away for free...Sorry but buissness just cant work effectively that well. And dont forget stardock are supporting the Gamers Bill...

A Beta is not worth 45$. A retail copy is worth 45$. Closed Beta is normally free. Demi-god's beta was simply a perk of pre-ordering - you're money not supposedly going towards the beta but the retail. Thus, because no retail product has been released yet, there should be full refunds.

A the gamer's bill... don't get me started on that pr stunt....

You've offered no reason for wanting to cancel your pre-order. You are simply arguing whether you have the right. Since you purchased the product under Stardocks terms, then you are subject to the conditions they have established regardless of what other companies do or your perception of what should be.

You paid for a full product and you will get the full product. By pre-ordering you are also eligible to beta access. The question is not what you paid for (pre-beta, retail, etc), but when payment was effected. There was full disclosure of when you would get billed. If you didn't like it, you should have bailed before Beta or waited till retail release.

The customer is not always right.

"Don't argue with idiots. They'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience" (c)

Quoting JinxOfSin,

reply 5

I'm glad you you enjoy the game and have confidence in it danw.

I contacted [email protected]. They said they can issue 75% back as the 25% needs to cover a mysterious "processing fee". I understand that online credit card charges cost a bit of money.

****

Hopefully an official word can grace this thread. Hopefully about giving a 100% refund

Translation: i understand that it costs money, but i want Stardock to pay for my stupidity. Then again, it's not Stardock who'll pay for it but other Stardock customers (as Stardock money doesn't appear from nowhere). As a Stardock customer i say thanks but no thanks, pay for you stupidity himself.

Now, same post:

Quoting JinxOfSin,

reply 5

However, whether or not you enjoy the game, I find it absurd that they're charging FULL RETAIL PRICE for the beta and offering no refunds.

Don't others see something weird here? I mean, in the same post JinxOfSin says that Stardock offers refunds and that they don't offer refunds. In the same post JinxOfSin says that they charge full retail price and that they return all but 25% of the full retail price. It's so stupid that i can't even argue with it.

Quoting JinxOfSin,

reply 8

You got your retail key. Stardock may refund you all but 11.25$. Also, it's not a closed beta, it's an open beta - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software_release_life_cycle "Developers release either a closed beta or an open beta; closed beta versions are released to a select group of individuals for a user test, while open betas are to a larger community group, usually the general public."

Quoting JinxOfSin,

reply 8

A the gamer's bill... don't get me started on that pr stunt....

Let's start it, why not? "Gamers shall have the right to return games that don't work with their computers for a full refund."

Sorry, EPIC FAIL once again. Learn to read.

Again, I didn't come here start any flames

I, for one, am glad that this thread is in no danger of descending into a flame war. Nope. No sir.

Quoting Ellestar,

reply 10

...General nerdrage...

Yes they do offer a 75% refund, which is still better than 0%. I'm arguing for 100% refund. I should have checked their refund policy more carefully so yes, that was my fault. However, you generally get your money back when cancelling pre-orders and as I said earlier, the beta was merely a pre-order perk.

As far as "closed beta" or "open beta" is concerned - you're really caught up in semantics aren't you? Does it matter which one precisely? You're right, in this case it would be termed as an open beta. My most sincere and humble apologies for that display of flawed vocabulary.

Regarding my opinion on the gamer's bill being a pr stunt, a stardock forum is not the appropriate place to argue that topic. There's no point starting a heated flamewar/getting banned for something so trivial. I don't dislike Stardock - in fact, I've bought a lot of their games as I mentioned earlier.

Like I said, I came to this board to ask about the refund options. 75% looks like the max they'll give unless there's technical issues. I feel I've made my point, some agree with me, some do not. You vehemently do not. You can have whatever opinions you like - that's your perogative - but you should be civil. Oh wait... internet... right...

Quoting Ke5trel,

reply 11

Again, I didn't come here start any flames

I, for one, am glad that this thread is in no danger of descending into a flame war. Nope. No sir.

It was inevitable - Stardock has some crazy fans

Good for them though. That's what helps them be successful.

The likelyhood of gettign banned for a reasonable discussion are nil. And I can't think of a better place to have the discussion; the most informed and interested people (at the moment) are right here.

However, you generally get your money back when cancelling pre-orders and as I said earlier, the beta was merely a pre-order perk.

I meant to qoute this in my other post . . but . .oh well.

The pre-orders I've participated in did not actually provide a working game. They were jsut a pre-order to be "first-in-line". I think that makes this a bit unique.

Quoting Zubaz,

reply 15

However, you generally get your money back when cancelling pre-orders and as I said earlier, the beta was merely a pre-order perk.I meant to qoute this in my other post . . but . .oh well.

The pre-orders I've participated in did not actually provide a working game. They were jsut a pre-order to be "first-in-line". I think that makes this a bit unique.

You do have a point there, but in addition, I've never (maybe I'm just naive) had to pay for an open beta either. Either you're paying full price ahead of time for the pre-order, or they're making you pay retail price for a beta. Which one? IMO, both of them are unheard of and honestly, I'm a little disappointed that they've chosen to do it this way.

Either you're paying full price ahead of time for the pre-order, or they're making you pay retail price for a beta. Which one? IMO, both of them are unheard of and honestly, I'm a little disappointed that they've chosen to do it this way.

Well obviously they are just charging full price ahead of time for pre-order. Why would they charge you retail price for a beta? They have offered to give you 75% back. I don't think you should get 100% back anyway. Like you said, it was a PERK for folks who PRE-ORDERED. Maybe you should have just waited for the demo. If you didn't want to participate in beta you should have waited. Why would you pre-order a game so far ahead of release date if you were even unsure if you wanted it?

Just take the 75% refund, count your losses and move on. $11.25 is hardly anything to whinge about, especially if you are at fault.

Kryo siad hte 75% refund is within 90 days or something. The game will be out past then so not much time ot see if you think the game is going to be worth it. probably won't be phase3 by then..

It's. Not. A. Freaking. Demo.

Seriously. I'm starting to get angry. I'm not a Stardock fanboy, but there's a simple solution--if you want to try the game, wait for the demo. The only reason to preorder a Stardock game is to ensure that the boxed copy you ordered with your download will arrive earlier. Since I can't really see that being an issue, unless you're the pickiest person alive, just buy the game at release, or after the demo.

Jinx, it sucks that you didn't know what you were getting into, I'll give you that. Stardock probably should put something on Impulse preorder pages that enumerates what exactly a preorder of a product-with-prerelease-beta entails, and I expect that would clear up these kinds of complaints.

The game is NOT released, the item we have recieved is NOT complete. To not be able to cancel and get a full refund for a game that isn't out yet is wrong. We preordered a game, not a beta. When you preorder in stores they give you rave cards and what not but you are still able to cancel. And other games that have done this allow for refunds. I mean we can sit here and argue all day, but in all reality you should get all your money back. I helped run a small franchise, the credit card fees suck but they are NO WHERE near 25%. And whereas the process is largely automated I don't see why it would cost so much. I understand if the game is released and what not the 25% is prefectly fine.

Did you know you'd be charged once you recieved your beta key? If so (and you should've), then I don't see why you'd complain other than to basically announce "Hey I pre-ordered to get in beta with the intention of cancelling it just to play it early for free, but my plans have been foiled." If you did not know (and I don't see you stating that you didn't) then you might have a valid complaint.

Stardock simply does their pre-orders differently than most, and this is no different than the Sins or GalCiv pre-orders. If you want to see how a game is before forking over money, wait for a demo. If you want to support them on faith, and maybe have some say in how the final product comes out, then you can pre-order.

These betas are not time-limited or anything like that, and as we get nearer to the game's completion the betas we'll get will be very near a full game, would you want them wasting time adding time limits or intentionally restricting content to prevent betaers who cancel from just playing a free game?

Sorry, but you're generalizing. You are saying I want to cancel because I just wanted a demo? No, not at all. I actually just needed the money back. The people who want refunds now deserve it for just what you said, they had faith and wanted to help Stardock out with providing money to finish the game before it's out. Also this is such an early stage it is more alpha then beta. If we had all the Demigods, were getting updates at more than a snail's pace, and had all the maps and options we don't deserve it because we are close to the full game. As of right now, this is nothing like the finished product.

No, not at all. I actually just needed the money back.

As I've said, if you feel you have an exceptional reason, you're free to explain it to sales. We're not inhuman. I can see that you've given quite a bit of feedback, so it does certainly seem that you've been here to help thus far. In Jinx's case though, this was his first post on the Demigod forums, which does not help his case much at all.

But in general, the policy stands. When you preorder, you're making a committment that you will buy the game. Not might, or probably if the beta looks good, will. That money then helps to keep development running smoothly, and your feedback helps to shape the game and ensure you get what you wanted. Requiring that committment ensures that only people who really do want to help do it. No, it's not like the way other companies do things, but it works well; Brad has commented in the past that no game we've ever used this model with has a metascore under 85 (IIRC).

The faith comments don't really work. Reaping the benefits of faith with no committment is just free entitlement, and as we've said, this isn't a demo.

Well you also need to make this much more clear when you purchuse the item. It said it was limited beta test NOT that you are buying beta software like your refund policy states. The way the policy is worded it says you are paying for the beta software not the game. I really think you need a lot more clarity or the more you use this model the more problems will arise. Also this request comes within the 90 days.

And yes I did have hopes to play through the beta and give as much feedback as I could, but life is life and doesn't always work out like that. I have contacted a CSR and it didn't go very far. I am awaiting a management email.

Quoting Legerdemain,

reply 6

It's convenient not to have to check the stores every week to see if the games made it's shipping date or if they've got stock in. Also there's often bonuses for people who pre-ordered. I do see your point though, for a digital download it makes little sense - it only really signals your support to the developer.

I always thought publishers wanted to encourage pre-orders as it allows them to better predict how their game will sell. I wasn't aware that Stardock felt so strongly about enforcing them, especially when it goes against what the rest of the industry does.

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Cancel Beta account and refund