That's new. I just tested it out. It never removed spit before, it's had to be changed in a recent patch.

I often play a Melee UB build (requires a specific favor item, as well as certain artifacts to work) in which I only put 1 point into Spit. It actually does much more damage than a maxed out Spit build, and can polish off pretty much any DG in seconds. All without the strict reliance on Spit. I'm sure others have differing builds for Unceal Beast as well...if only to show off the flexibility of this amazing game's skill/item combinations.

I started off with UB as my first DG and still play it. My first builds were always reliant on spit. It's great for getting that first blow in before you pounce on an enemy DG and it's even good for laying down some continuing damage on them as they try to flee back into their towers or teleport. Nice for towers, too.

But I'm now playing with an UB without any spit at all. From the posts in this thread, you'd think I was insane for doing so, but I actually find that a pure melee UB works great. I push the points into Inner Beast, Foul Grasp (as soon as possible) and Diseased Claws if I really want a DG killer! I even channel points into attribute enhancement. Once I've levelled up a bit, grabbed Journeyman's Treads and Mage Slayer or (if it's a longer game / many players for the gold boost) Ashkendor, I've got a pretty solid build. Nothing in there is an "I Win" button. It's just a good solid build where I do everything to boost my principle of being a vicious bastard. I don't usually go so far as getting plague. Not because it isn't good - I think it's excellent - but just because it takes away from my focus. Post Mortem has to do as my means of boosting my minion killing. If there's an enemy DG in there, then I'm probably focused on it, and if there isn't then I don't need plague to deal with minions. I also tend to get ring of Namor / Namoth (?) because I love Lifestealing.

Spit is good, very good at later levels. But I actually prefer a build without it.

Heh, of course it is.

My usual counter to Venom Spit is to rush the enemy UB as soon as he comes in range.

I know this sounds counter-intuitive, but a UB that is heavily invested in Spit (especially early game) is not as effective at melee combat; he relies on wearing you down over time with multiple spits. If you force him to fight you the *first* time, and drain his HP so he has to heal, spit harass is not as effective.

This really only works with TB - non-ranged heroes cannot counter spit this way, and Regulus does not have enough burst damage to kill UB early. However, hybrid TB can make short work of UB until at least level 10.

I find that many enemy UBs rely on the psychological advantage of spit, expecting me to run when they come and hit me with it. When I turn around and drop RoI + Fire Nova + Fireball, then THEY are the ones running. With Permafrost, this can even turn into a kill. UB is much more wary of attacking me after that.

Restoration scroll only removes debuffs from minions.

Personally, I prefer Ooze over Spit anyway (a huge debuff to damage dealt to you, AoE, comparable damage, and with a good Ooze build you don't have to worry about runners anyway).

i'm german and when i wrote the post, it hadn't been released already. i have an original now

Oak needs to go with all health upgrades if playing assassin build, plus upgrade pen as soon as possible its the only way to out-live spit and hacking of claws, plus shield = tough opponent.  I have beaten oaks but the best can sometimes get the upper hand.  I don't know the other builds.

Erebus can be harassed pretty easily IMO.  So can sedna, but she shrugs it off and might pounce you, i recommend holding off 1v1 with her until a UB gets Foul Grasp for the stun and extra damage.  Stunning the heal is hard, but I have done it, some of the time from luck but sometimes from recognizing a heal situation.

Reg can do mark of the betrayer and throw mines in the path which makes it a pain to want to go through with, but at best a reg is just gonna have UB wait until troops take mine damage and just spit anyway even with MotB.

QoT, watch out.  UB is the last place you want to be, no joke.  Shields reduce so much faster with spit, plus any reinforcement or a second DG and GG.  Plus, spit regens fast and any good UB will be carrying mana + mana regen items specifically Heart of Life, so your limited damage is a bad combo.

Rook best way to avoid spit is towerfarm, but still not very effective for repelling spit.  Melee damage yes, but I have killed rooks before with all spit who had ful towerfarm planted.

Against other UB, just mirror their actions if possible.  If he spits, you spit.  If he attacks, you attack.  Trust me when I say that dying once to another UB is educational and beneficial to you, because then you will know if you can keep looking for him to kill or not.  He will no doubt be determined for another shot if he loses, due to human ego.  If you lose to him, now you know who to avoid.

And btw TB's, ring of fire does not prevent people from moving inside it, which is the way some of you play it as.  Against rook maybe that strat works, but UB is fast and takes little damage to give you a huge amount of spit.  Any experienced player will know if they can withstand the initial fire TB damage burst, or the effects of ice TB, and if they can survive it then a UB will be able to put a fresh batch of spit on ye and start hacking with some claws.  Slowed movement speed is delicious at this point, plus no movement upgrade = Smote

So first you say that his argument is baseless. And then you ask him for more details?