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UB Pro Guide

Legit Guide

By on February 17, 2012 11:30:35 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

JUSThaveFUN

Join Date 08/2009
+20

 

UB Pro Guide

This is a guide for mid to very high skilled ub players who are trying to perfect UB.

 

Preface

The unclean beast is one of the strongest and at the same time most difficult demigods to master on a very high level. Multiple pros agree on that he might even be the hardest. Unclean beast has no escape skills, but a lot of hp. Furthermore, when to commit to a fight, who to focus, when to stun takes thousands of games of experience.

 

Chapter 1

Builds

The most common build order is Banded armor + Scaled helm, Unbreakable boots, Nimoth chest armor, Hauberk of Life and Plenor Battle Crown (sell scaled helm first).

This build order is fine in it's way and will get you through any fight.

However, the starting items can vary with ub.

 

Early Sigil

Banded armor + a Sigil of Vitality is a very interesting start. You can instantly go out and don't have to wait at the shop to accumulate enough gold. This can lead to the first flag grab which leads in a pro game to a small experience advantage.

Problems:

  • It puts you 500 gold behind the enemy if you used it without getting a kill.

  • you have less mana to use, so use it wisely, do not spit the tower

So why even bother with an early sigil?

  • you can risk more and always have the safety of having that sigil

  • it messes with the opponents head, who will never know if you have a sigil or not

  • unexpected early teamganks with ports you can easily escape. They waste 250 gold on a teleport scroll and miss experience waves on the other lanes

My tip is if you go for the early sigil play like you don't have one and it will pay for maintaining flag control. Because few players will play down to 400 hp if they don't have a sigil themselves and if they do they either die or both of you use a sigil and it is a pat.

 

Starting with pots

Other alternatives is going for banded armor + 1 healthpot + 1 mana pot. If you're feeling frisky and want to mix it up to mess with your opponents heads it can get you an early kill or give flag control. On the other hand you do lose 475 gold, and will be 475 gold behind. I call this semi all in build.

 

Boots of Speed

Another one which I call an All in strategy is rushing through the map with Boots of Speed. The person who coined this UB was IamKira. Basically you try to overwhelm your opponents and punish them for any miss micro to get early kills. The speed increase from 6.3 to 6.9 can catch players off-guard and is most powerful for teleport ganks. But use with care, keep in mind you put yourself 1000 gold behind from the standard build with an item slot being used by the boots of speed. If you don't kill you lose flag control, race to the good items, and eventually the game--> all in strategy.

 

 

Scalemail

When to use Scalemail, which gives you +600 armor for only 400 gold. You can start out with banded armor and Scalemail and try to win the early flag fights by just dominating longer autoattacks. Throughout the game, when fights are very close a lot of pros will buy Scalemail as their 3rd or 4th item to get an edge of an advantage in fights. It is very cheap and does a lot and will refund you 320 gold when sold. Overall a very good underused item when everyone is gold hungry and cannot finish their standard builds.

 

Mana Controversy

UB needs 1 mana helm with the Blood of the Fallen Favor. The question is which one of the two: plenor battle crown or vlemish faceguard?

The answer is not simple. It really depends on the playstyle and the demigods you are facing.

 

a ) Plenor Battle Crown: +1575 Mana

+70% Mana per second

b ) Vlemish Faceguard: + 1050 Mana

+11 Mana per second

+4 mana per second aura

 

This is my subjective interpretation which helm to use when:

Use helm a if you are a very aggressive player and try to kill a person every time you are in a fight. The reason is you need all the mana you can get what a high regen helm cannot give you in the seconds of the fight.

 

Use helm b if you are a more passive UB that spits multiple times while staying back, or trying to work towers down. The reason is simple you are trying to do damage over time where a high regen helm works better for you than a high base mana pool.

 

General use of mana with UB. As a professional player you know in advance what you are trying to accomplish. There are 2 major objectives in the beginning of the game with UB.

Do I want to work the tower down or fight the enemy at all costs. Usually I see players trying to do both. The problem is if the enemy does conserve all his mana to fight you and you spit just only 1 time on the tower you will lose flag control and will have to retreat earlier to base → losing experience waves and hp on your own tower.

 

My word of advice: always save your mana for a big fight 1v1 or 2v2. Only spit on the tower when you are planning to go back to base anyways.

 

Infamous Ooze UB

-Start with Banded Armor and Scale mail

-Buy currency 1 for your team so they can focus on getting the Bishops/ High Priests for you

Ooze Ub needs to have them early more than another item because of his insane hp pool, no mana dependency, and high armor!

-Get Nimoth Chest Armor, Duelist's Cuirass, Narmoth Ring, Unbreakable Boots (sell Scale mail), Orb of Defiance, Hauberk of Life (Sell Banded Armor)

You have to vary your buy order depending on how the game is going. If it is a passive farm fest go for the big items. If the game is a fight fest buy the very next heath item you can afford.



Chapter 2

Picking the right favor

 

The most common favors are Blood of the Fallen (Botf), Blade of the Serpent (Bots), and Crimson Vial. Other favors might be viable in 4v4s and 5vs5, but sadly this game is 3v3 based.

 

Blood

If you do not know what favor to pick, you can never be wrong with Botf. No other standard item gives you +800 health and +5 health per second. And with UB you will be very strong from lvl 1. You can push enemies away, yellow cap, tank towers, gain higher monk heals, have higher overall hp with hp flag, and higher hp with sigil.

 

Problems and resolutions:

-You have mana issues all game

Use your mana wisely, and always go back to base to heal it up when you are below half mana, or have a support occulus in your team composition

 

 

Blade

Blade of the Serpent I have only seen played successfully by Soccermom. This favor I recommend only for UB players that want to play out advantages, kill towers, and can manage being pushed around all game. If you make it to end game with this favor and have a healer or shielder on your team it is the strongest UB. However the game can be decided early on very easy since you have almost no presence.

 

Problems and resolutions:

-You have a very low hp base until you completed your build for a very long time

Rush all flat hp items first, do not buy mana items at all ( except Unbreakable Boots), don't ever commit unless you know you will win, try to build in a healer in your composition

 

Vial

Vial UB is getting more popular with the day of the game. It is the most powerful build in most 1v1s. However the more players are in the game the more vial falls off. Just like serpent you will get easily pushed around but have no mana advantage. With this build you are planning to out sustain your opponent in lane. And the real advantage comes when you use it after you sigil. The bigger the map the better this favor choice becomes. And if fights last very long and you are not getting stunned you will last the longest with vial.

 

Problems and resolutions:

-mana issues all game and hp issues

Wear your opponent down so your vial takes advantage eventually. Lategame make the opponent commit to fights, because that's when your build starts paying off. As a general rule 8/10 times use vial after you sigil when laning phase is over.

For more information on the favors and Builds contact:

Orcun, Fairlight_, Mythrandar, Zen_God for Blood

OMG_Soccermom, Koush for Blade

Mcshance, nnnils, ppapanek for Vial

 



Chapter 3

Skill points and Level based Aggression


The Standard UB*

The Surprise UB**

The infamous Ooze UB***

lvl 1 Ooze I

lvl 2 Venom Spit I

lvl 3 save

lvl 4 Venom Spit II + Ooze II

lvl 5 Foul Grasp I

lvl 6 save

lvl 7 Venom Spit III + Ooze III

lvl 8 Diseased Claws

lvl 9 save

lvl 10 Venom Spit IV + Ooze IV

lvl 11 Inner Beast I

lvl 12 Inner Beast II

lvl 13 Inner Beast III

lvl 14 save

lvl 15 Putrid Flow + Acclimation

lvl 16-20 Enhanced Attributes

lvl 1 Venom Spit I

lvl 2 Diseased Claws I

lvl 3 Ooze I

lvl 4 Venom Spit II

lvl 5 Foul Grasp I

lvl 6 Ooze II

lvl 7 Venom Spit III

lvl 8 Ooze III

lvl 9 save

lvl 10 Venom Spit IV + Ooze IV

lvl 11 Inner Beast I

lvl 12 Inner Beast II

lvl 13 Inner Beast III

lvl 14 Post Mortem

lvl 15 Acclimation

lvl 16 Putrid Flow

lvl 17 Foul Grasp III

lvl 18 Plague I

lvl 19 Plague II

lvl 20 Diseased Claws II

lvl 1 Ooze I

lvl 2 Diseased Claws I

lvl 3 Inner Beast I

lvl 4 Ooze II

lvl 5 Foul Grasp I

lvl 6 Inner Beast II

lvl 7 Ooze III

lvl 8 Inner Beast III

lvl 9 Enhanced Attributes I

lvl 10 Ooze IV

lvl 11 Foul Grasp II

lvl 12 Enhanced Attributes II

lvl 13 Enhanced Attributes III

lvl 14 save

lvl 15 Acclimation

+ Foul Grasp III

lvl 16 Bestial Wrath I

lvl 17 Bestial Wrath II

lvl 18 Bestial Wrath III

lvl 19 Bestial Wrath IV

lvl 20 Unrelenting Wraith

 * Instead of skilling Diseased Claws you can max Foul Grasp, which is very powerful on Ooze UB and Blade UB

** DO NOT USE POST MORTEM AND PLAGUE I-II UNTIL THE GAME IS LAG FIXED

*** From lvl 16 to 18 you can max Enhance attributes instead and leave lvl19 and 20  open for your choice of experimentation

 

 

The Standard

 

This is the most played UB on almost all Favor Items. You can't go wrong with this skill tree and can accomplish a lot without relying on teammates.

Early lvls you want to focus on farm and lvls. Once you reach lvl 4 or 5 you can start making a few aggressive plays. At lvl 7 is the next point where you usually have the highest damage output and should make a few aggressive plays. Then you should lvl hard again until lvl 10 and take advantage of your maxed ooze and spit. If the games is still even lvl hard till lvl 15 and become an unstoppable killing machine.

 

Pros

-strong burst damage

-excellent tower killer

 

Cons

-has to shop a lot to keep up with the mana needs

 

The Surprise UB

Don't ever play this UB online, but only in Single Player. The reason is it will lag the game insanely and make it unplayable. I call this the surprise UB because you will catch a lot of opponents off guard with the diseased claws (which slows them for 5%). Furthermore It is hard to calculate the damage that plague does, especially end game with Giants on the field.

 

I don't have enough experience to give advice on lvl based aggression


Pros

-excellent burst and surprise

-best aoe UB

 

Cons

-he will lag the game

-mana issues

 

The infamous Ooze UB

This is the newest and most underplayed skilled tree. Cowbuttzex is the only one that has attempted that build. From my own experience I vary on the skill choices and item build. This UB has high reliance on perfect team play. You need the Bishops/High priests on you at all times of the game. Also this is a “I want to fight UB”. So the composition with your teammates has to be right so that they are ready to fight when you are.

 

Early on you will be this massive tank that is hard to get the hp down, and can surprise kill someone with his slow and higher attack speed/movement speed. Around lvl 10 you will be the fastest and tankiest, who does constant damage. Once you reach lvl 15 nothing can kill you. You can literally sit among 3 people for ages. So the general idea is to absorb damage all game and be at full health with Bishops/High priests. And punish over extension, since you can go anywhere late game without dying.


Pros

-excellent long term team fighter

-excellent tank that wants to take damage nonstop

-gets the most out of his aoe ooze

-never “needs” to shop

-no mana dependency

 

Cons

-he doesn't have a real surprise burst

-very predictable

-useless without coordinated teamplay

For more and different insight on the Ooze UB contact:

Cowbuttzex

 



Chapter 4

How do I become a professional Unclean Beast?

 

This Chapter will be me rambling about my philosophy of how to master anything and what to work on to get there. I used my analytical skills and experiences. If you are easily bored skip this part and go to “Applying these skills on perfecting the Unclean Beast”.

 

What a pro makes a pro

On a competitive plate, there are three main skills one has to accomplish before succeeding against others. Mind Control, Mechanical Perfectionism, and Strategy.

 

Mind Control is the awareness of the moment here and now every second you are living. In other words you are awake and fresh and know what you are doing. Think about when you have an adrenalin rush when something exciting happened. You usually can recall every single moment of what happened and made decisions for every single moment while having that rush. Now Mind Control is not as extreme as having an adrenalin rush. However, it is a practiced awareness of the brain to know exactly what you are doing every moment. This takes years of practice.

 

Mechanical Perfectionism is simply put the experience with the work or game you are performing. You just automatically know what to do in every situation from failures before that and apply the right moves as a result of that. For instance, in a chess game you know you can't do certain chess moves because you will fall into a trap, which you fell for before.

 

Strategy, is in general you mapping what you will be doing in the profession you choose. Nothing you do should be a surprise to you or feel new because you know what methods apply in every circumstance. You start out with a mapped plan that changes over time. Caused by the following Variables: mishaps, unforeseen circumstances, doing better than expected.

For example, in a soccer game you have a set line up and an idea to either go full aggressive or play ball control. This strategy changes over time and can be influenced, if your team has a lot of unfortunate mistakes, it rains or your opponent have a better strategy against your line up, and/or your team is having a lot of good plays and everything is working.

 

 

Applying these skills on perfecting the Unclean Beast

 

Mind control

Every single second of the game you are aware of every single step your Character is doing. You almost visualize yourself making every single move and become the Unclean Beast. When you get to the point where you catch yourself walking in a bad direction for one second or didn't know what you were doing you have almost mastered Mind Control. You could call it active thinking, which will power your brain to its maximum, when you can do that for multiple games in a row.

Examples are, I will start walking straight to mana flag and then to mid flag and back in order to gain flags and creep experience. While sitting on a flag or walking towards a flag you think about other options that are available. For instance, while walking to mid flag you see your opponent capturing the mana flag, you instantly go back to mana flag to yellow cap him ( you deny your opponent the full experience of capturing a flag and gain it yourself ). In other words you never find yourself on the map feeling like you are not doing anything because there are so many options that you weight in importance in just milliseconds.

It is important to remember, you don't act on something because you feel like it, but you act on something because you know from experience you will gain an advantage or succeed with your choice unless the opponent makes an unforeseen move that will usually result in an overall advantage for your team.

 

Mechanical Perfectionism

The truth of mastering your highest skill potential with UB is by playing with him every single day and trying out everything. Your teammates will rage at you and you will lose a lot of games because of your attempts. However, your memory automatically always takes note of what worked and what not. It helps a lot if you actively say it in your mind of what went wrong and what you should have done instead to make it right the next time you find yourself in the same scenario with Unclean Beast.

In order to never die you must have died the most. Also, look for games against stronger players where you know you have no chance in “hell” you can win that game. Save the replays and look what they did that made them so much better than you. And conclude why at some point they have so much more items and map control than you. Step by Step you will increase your overall gameplay immensely.

 

Strategy

You don't have to bother with strategy to become an excellent player. However if you're looking in becoming a professional Unclean Beast player it is impossible without it. You have to know all weaknesses and strengths of all demigods in combination and alone, when which item is the most optimum to purchase, when to push a tower or fight the enemy, and how map control works.

This takes a lot of hard thinking and counting in so many variables that are impossible as a new to mid skilled lvl player.

My word of advice: just because something didn't work out what sounded well in theory does not make it a bad strategy. Usually executing your strategy is where it fails and will take a lot of practice. Start by thinking of things that make perfect sense, and adjust them the more they don't seem to work too well.

(Personal Example, I always used to play vial rook in the demo and thought of it as the most powerful rook being unreliable on teammates. But then I got crushed online in multiplayer. A few years after I played against the same rook I used to play in the demo and realized that my strategy was right and I was just poor in executing it because I lacked mechanical and mind control skills. So I tried a new attempt and it became the most popular build to date on rook)

 

In Conclusion

You have to master Mind Control, Mechanical Skill, and Strategy evenly and combine them in order to have a chance in becoming a professional Unclean Beast and over all player. This does not happen over night, this takes commitment and disciplined practice like with anything else you do in Life you want to succeed in.

 

If you are interested in discussing professional gaming and strategy further contact:

ppapanek

Thundercles

Hedgie

Orcun

Koush

Darkliath

Zen_God

 

 More chapters coming soon...

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February 20, 2012 8:14:09 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

updated on request on how to become a pro UB

let me know if you guys wanna hear about sth I haven't touched yet

edit: edited the Standard UB build apparently i'm the only one that prefers maxing grasp, which has to do with my psychotic playstyle that every extra 100 hp extra damage counts for me

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February 21, 2012 3:59:30 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Wow, demigod just got all spiritual. Build ideas appreciated I nearly laughed my head off with the whole mind control stuff until I realized that people actually do take playing a computer game that seriously.... This level of focus applied to real life would ensure success in what we do.

At least there's some pro players, it would be a shame if you were not paid for this level of focus. I'd like to get sponsored but I'll never be that good.

Gaming addiction can be destructive to one's life if taken seriously. So for the players who are not pro and don't get paid, they must balance their life or become unhealthy. There's people out there who wear nappies at the pc so they don't need to afk for nature. I Also heard a person died playing WOW because he didn't eat or drink for too long and his heart stopped.

So remember the recommendation for gaming to get up and move, and eat and toilet regularly. JusthaveFun I'm happy for you that you made it pro and I hope the money is worth it, and at that level I'm sure you take gaming safety as a priority. Good luck in your career and thanks for the secrets of how to play.

I knew a person who was pro HALO player, she got paid up to $20,000 for a win at some tournaments, but eventually health was very poor and now many hospital visits. Obesity is a silent killer.

 

My usual UB skill tree build.

1:spit

2:ooze.

3: Inner beast (especially when playing the creep + centre flag dance)

4:spit2

5: Foul Grasp.

6: ooze2

7: spit3

8:innerbeast 2

9: disease claws or save depending if enemy is speed or not.

10: spit4 (and ooze3 if saved )

11: ooze3 or disease claws whichever is not picked.

12: innerbeast3

13:  diseased claws 2

14: save

15: Putrid,  Acclimation,

16 disease claws 3

17. Post moretem (I find only this skill causes not much lag at all. Plague is definitely a no-no)

18. Grasp 2

19. grasp3

20. Attributes.

 

I find this build an advantage over the spit+ooze max to level 10 build, because the inner beast speed and attack speed is good counter to other UB builds. At level 8 with boots of speed and inner beast2, then a kill can be chased down with surprising effectiveness, plus if you're getting hammered by a max DPS beast then a grasp, turn ooze to stop grasp, then immediately run can save a sigil waste.BOTF is a must IMHO for this build. You gotta act like you're weak and low mana... and BTW I am a 2 hat beast 1500 and 1750 hat like it or not. The speed+maxing spit is great for tower harrying and pushing at the same time. I know many make mistake of trying to fight and spit towers at same time but I do it with great effectiveness! (Note I never spit on a tower before level 10)

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February 21, 2012 6:36:34 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting JUSThaveFUN,
There's people out there who wear nappies at the pc so they don't need to afk for nature

ummm... laugh. Man that's funny.

 

Quick question on topic. If you go beyond foul grasp 1 (as I never have or can't recall doing so) is the ooze bug still exploitable?

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February 21, 2012 8:24:50 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting JUSThaveFUN,
Maybe that's why I always come out ahead in them UB fights shane

Lol someone seems to have developed early onset dementia.


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February 21, 2012 12:45:10 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting doggu,
Quick question on topic. If you go beyond foul grasp 1 (as I never have or can't recall doing so) is the ooze bug still exploitable?
yes it works the exact same way with grasp 2 and 3.. this means also if zen is using it hes not even gonna benefit from those extra 300 hps..

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February 21, 2012 2:42:19 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting Elend_Venture,
There's people out there who wear nappies at the pc so they don't need to afk for nature.

 

 

Where can you get those?

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February 21, 2012 4:06:41 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting nnnils,

Quoting doggu, reply 53Quick question on topic. If you go beyond foul grasp 1 (as I never have or can't recall doing so) is the ooze bug still exploitable?yes it works the exact same way with grasp 2 and 3.. this means also if zen is using it hes not even gonna benefit from those extra 300 hps..

Easy on em out there nnnils, everyone's friends here. 

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February 21, 2012 4:22:23 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting nnnils,
yes it works the exact same way with grasp 2 and 3.. this means also if zen is using it hes not even gonna benefit from those extra 300 hps..

heh

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February 21, 2012 4:49:03 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting GM-McShane87,
Easy on em out there nnnils, everyone's friends here.
I need some explanation on that statement pls

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February 21, 2012 5:52:49 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting GM-McShane87,

Quoting JUSThaveFUN, reply 46Maybe that's why I always come out ahead in them UB fights shane

Lol someone seems to have developed early onset dementia.


Haha it depends on which time ranges you look
Quoting doggu,
Quick question on topic. If you go beyond foul grasp 1 (as I never have or can't recall doing so) is the ooze bug still exploitable?
Even if it is a bug, I think it highers the skill cap on UB and makes the game more interesting.

Quoting nnnils,

Quoting doggu, reply 53Quick question on topic. If you go beyond foul grasp 1 (as I never have or can't recall doing so) is the ooze bug still exploitable?yes it works the exact same way with grasp 2 and 3.. this means also if zen is using it hes not even gonna benefit from those extra 300 hps..
Well here is the true fact about "pro" lvl gaming. You want to use your full grasp in a fight, because fights are going to last longer, and you want to rely on other disables to stop people from porting away that don't do damage. Especially in close fights the quick heal makes a big difference. Like the usual save stun mentality so no one gets out won't work against pros. Everything has to be used to just come out ahead in a fight. In just a mathematical viewpoint the ub that spits and does 600 damage and heal on him will be ahead in that moment to the UB that didn't go full grasp or doesn't even use it. The higher the skill lvl is the more small advantages like this will win you the game.
Quoting Elend_Venture,
Wow, demigod just got all spiritual. Build ideas appreciated I nearly laughed my head off with the whole mind control stuff until I realized that people actually do take playing a computer game that seriously.... This level of focus applied to real life would ensure success in what we do.

At least there's some pro players, it would be a shame if you were not paid for this level of focus. I'd like to get sponsored but I'll never be that good.

Gaming addiction can be destructive to one's life if taken seriously. So for the players who are not pro and don't get paid, they must balance their life or become unhealthy. There's people out there who wear nappies at the pc so they don't need to afk for nature. I Also heard a person died playing WOW because he didn't eat or drink for too long and his heart stopped.

So remember the recommendation for gaming to get up and move, and eat and toilet regularly. JusthaveFun I'm happy for you that you made it pro and I hope the money is worth it, and at that level I'm sure you take gaming safety as a priority. Good luck in your career and thanks for the secrets of how to play.

I knew a person who was pro HALO player, she got paid up to $20,000 for a win at some tournaments, but eventually health was very poor and now many hospital visits. Obesity is a silent killer.

 

My usual UB skill tree build.

1:spit

2:ooze.

3: Inner beast (especially when playing the creep + centre flag dance)

4:spit2

5: Foul Grasp.

6: ooze2

7: spit3

8:innerbeast 2

9: disease claws or save depending if enemy is speed or not.

10: spit4 (and ooze3 if saved )

11: ooze3 or disease claws whichever is not picked.

12: innerbeast3

13:  diseased claws 2

14: save

15: Putrid,  Acclimation,

16 disease claws 3

17. Post moretem (I find only this skill causes not much lag at all. Plague is definitely a no-no)

18. Grasp 2

19. grasp3

20. Attributes.

 

I find this build an advantage over the spit+ooze max to level 10 build, because the inner beast speed and attack speed is good counter to other UB builds. At level 8 with boots of speed and inner beast2, then a kill can be chased down with surprising effectiveness, plus if you're getting hammered by a max DPS beast then a grasp, turn ooze to stop grasp, then immediately run can save a sigil waste.BOTF is a must IMHO for this build. You gotta act like you're weak and low mana... and BTW I am a 2 hat beast 1500 and 1750 hat like it or not. The speed+maxing spit is great for tower harrying and pushing at the same time. I know many make mistake of trying to fight and spit towers at same time but I do it with great effectiveness! (Note I never spit on a tower before level 10)

Strategic wise your build could work, however there are multiple variables you are leaving out or just not familiar with that will make your skill order and build order very weak. If I find more time and you really want my opinion on your strategy I will write it up.

Also if you love mana helms so much I recommend you to try out the Blade of the Serpent UB in my guide. On request I can look up some high lvl blade UB played by Soccermom in one of the last 3v3 tournaments.

About the pro mind set, yeah it is extreme, but that's how it is in any other serious taken sport. And the examples you named are all single extremes that happen in any kind of profession. You don't have to be a professional gamer to get yourself fat and killed.

About the money thing, I truly play out of glory and geeky purposes. I made compared to other games no high amounts of $$$ with Demigod. Just being fortunate enough to win 4-5 international tournaments in a video game made me very happy. Furthermore, it helped me to develop as a human being a lot and I moved on to League of Legends where I am being introduced into a million world wide competitive scene.

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February 21, 2012 6:08:56 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting JUSThaveFUN,
In just a mathematical viewpoint the ub that spits and does 600 damage and heal on him will be ahead in that moment to the UB that didn't go full grasp or doesn't even use it.
In a mathematical viewpoint im pretty sure that the ub with 2 points in enhanced attributes instead of grasp 3 is stronger.. keep in mind that u`ll have more hp/mana/armor etc and u gonna be able to spit/grasp once more than the opposing ub..

I also doubt that ur not using the grasp bug at all..

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February 21, 2012 6:22:59 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting JUSThaveFUN,
Even if it is a bug, I think it highers the skill cap on UB and makes the game more interesting.

Are you saying you don't exploit the bug?

Now where are those tourney replays??

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February 21, 2012 9:26:02 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting K_B,

Quoting Elend_Venture, reply 52 There's people out there who wear nappies at the pc so they don't need to afk for nature.




 

 

Where can you get those?

 

They're called Depend. Adult Diapers.

 

What's this bug ur all talking about?? Is interrupting your own grasp by turning on/off ooze considered a bug? I'm sure it can also be interrupted by cast//cancel a pot or tele... and rooks structural transfer is similarly able to be cancelled. If grasp cannot be cancelled then it becomes an unrealiable skill pinning you in place when u need to run...effectively stunning yourself and your opponent. No other stun/interrupt/silence has a negative effect on the casting DG that this would be if you couldn't turn and run after casting.

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February 21, 2012 9:35:13 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting Elend_Venture,
What's this bug ur all talking about??

spit, grasp, then ooze ON during the grasp means you can get in a couple of aa's while your opponent can't attack you or do anything as they are stunned for the grasp duration. It's a very significant adv if you hit 5 first (ub vs ub) and your opponent is stupid enough to engage. And it is still a good exploit vs whoever/whenever...

Anyways.... back to the diapers... I thought you meant a brand of diaper marketed to gamers (LOL!!!!!!). Depends are just for old people (or pacov) as they can't hold their bladder... 

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February 21, 2012 10:22:49 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting doggu,

Quoting Elend_Venture, reply 63What's this bug ur all talking about??

spit, grasp, then ooze ON during the grasp means you can get in a couple of aa's while your opponent can't attack you or do anything as they are stunned for the grasp duration. It's a very significant adv if you hit 5 first (ub vs ub) and your opponent is stupid enough to engage. And it is still a good exploit vs whoever/whenever...

Anyways.... back to the diapers... I thought you meant a brand of diaper marketed to gamers (LOL!!!!!!). Depends are just for old people (or pacov) as they can't hold their bladder... 

This is also how you can escape with UB
Grasp -> Ooze off -> Run
Gives you a 1.5 second head start.

What the pros want you to believe about UB... don't suck down the cool aid.

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February 21, 2012 11:23:56 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting LORD-ORION,
This is also how you can escape with UB
Grasp -> Ooze off -> Run
Gives you a 1.5 second head start.

You forgot to add in jtreads.  Only person maybe catching u at that point is da.

*pipe down butch.

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February 21, 2012 11:51:04 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting nnnils,
In a mathematical viewpoint im pretty sure that the ub with 2 points in enhanced attributes instead of grasp 3 is stronger.. keep in mind that u`ll have more hp/mana/armor etc and u gonna be able to spit/grasp once more than the opposing ub..

I also doubt that ur not using the grasp bug at all..

In the end you are talking about scenarios where your play style might be better, while I talk about other scenarios where my plays style will be more effective. I just believe that burst beats in the long run overall damage in 3v3s early to mid game, unless you go pure super tank. I only use the grasp cancel mechanic as an escape. However when only putting one point in it, canceling it right away makes of course more sense.

Also you can question everything I say in this guide for your specific scenarios and give reasonable explanations why your way will be better. I'm just naming my strategies that had the highest win percentage from over 1k UB games spread on 3 different accounts and worked the best for me, and made me win 4-5 tournaments.

It seems more like you are trying too hard to have better ways, while your are committing the fallacy of situational gameplay. I'm purely focusing on the best case scenarios where no one makes a mistake all game. Just keep in mind my way is not the only way to play of course. However, don't understand me wrong, I love feedback, but you are very persisting and it seems like we are talking at cross-purposes. I preferred your private discussion approach so things will be more clear what we are trying to express.

For clarification, under the oldies pros it was agreed that the Grasp cancel will not be seen as a bug, but as a nice game mechanic. Just as the capturing gold flag without getting hit by the turret is accepted.

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February 21, 2012 11:53:00 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting LORD-ORION,
This is also how you can escape with UB
Grasp -> Ooze off -> Run
Gives you a 1.5 second head start.

Did you bury the hatchet yet ?

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February 21, 2012 11:59:56 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting K_B,

Quoting LORD-ORION, reply 26NVM:
What a joke this community is

The palace is falling apart and everyone is abandoning ship... and the few "elite" players that can't see past the fishbowl continue on like everything is fine... while they go play LoL.

Ridiculous

 

Lets assume the elite players do see the palace falling apart in their little fishbowl.

 

What should they do, fill the forums with wailing and moans of despair?

 

Or are you perhaps able to suggest a remedy, a few simple steps we can all take that will rebuild the palace and get our fishbowl upgraded to a lake......

 

Its just I'm struggling at the moment to understand the point of your post.

 

1st you must not fail at reading comprehension, and consider that my position is based on pug and n00b perceptions, and how UB actually works for the vast majority of the players once they reach their potential. (sort of why I made sure to quote what I quoted in the 1st post that started all this)

2nd then you must see people argue with what I actually agreed with, yet ignoring what I didn't agree with...
UB opness for people with the inferior meta gaming skill at the pug and n00b level. That is to say they get caught in the described UB trap easily, and the fight is over. Surely I was angry when I made my post... but it is infuriating to watch the same people say crazy ass shit that just does not jive with the "non-pro/non-friends of pros" community.

3rd, to prove this, go play a bunch of pug/moderate games and take UB every single time, and you will invariably come across people asking you not to play UB, or say UB is banned... ask why....or try taking UB in pantheon, that is a sure fire to watch disconnects as soon as the game starts...

4th, please consider my solution the BalMod I made

I will post the changes to UB here and describe for expediency

Base Speed 6.0 (normally 6.3)
Diseased Claw 5%,10%,15% speed reduction (normally 5%,7%,10%)
Ooze:  10%,15%,20%,25% Attack Speed penalty (normally 10%,20%,30%,40%)
Acclimation 25% (down from 40%)
Bestial Wrath Duration 15,15,15,20 (normally 7,7,7,10)
Foul Grasp Drain 83,166,249 (normally 83,125,166)

1st understand that "pro" UBs are incredibly patient, deadly precise with their calculations, and will kill you dead if you make any mistakes. The same can be said for any demigod pro UB is likely to be facing in pro games. (LE, Oak, Rook, UB)

2nd understand that the typical "average" or "dangerous n00b" player plays UB like a damage dealing, full speed ahead, tank/carry... where they know itemization, to level on the mana side and to play the trap (spit -> ooze -> spit grasp -> spit) and do very well with this crazy aggressive style until they meet someone good with a good demigod.

Now, on to the explanation

1) What matters to "average joes" and what does not really matter all that much to "pros"

Base Speed 6.3 to 6.0
That -5% makes a big difference to average joes and their wreckless feeding frenzy. That can't close and kill on every demigod without some planning on the other DG's itemization.

For certain even average players will have Inner Beast 3, and probably also 1 point in Diseased Claw. That puts their net speed at +20% compared to all the other demigods (speed 6.3 + 10% (inner beast) + 5% snare (diseased claw). Even in the worst case scenarios of sucking at itemization, speed 6.3 UB can keep to nearly any demigod that makes a mistake.

For pros... this 5% does not make much difference at all... UB is more of a road block that threatens the lane menacingly, daring someone to come out and get a special dose of damage if they over-extend. That is to say, pro UBs are content to push and pull depending on the advantage while they do everything in their power to get every point of XP and gold possible. Mistakes by UB have him waste mana on dealing ineffective damage and ultimately have him cede the lane... where mistakes by the UB's targets take an overabundance of damage, and either have to hang back and temporarily accept pressure on their tower, or make a base trip to refill.

So, with 3 inner beast and 1 diseased claw, we have Speed 6.6 + 5% snare = 15% net speed. That is starting to look more even with what options players have to keep away from you unless you itemize (which has various trade-offs)

2) Diseased Claw 5,10,15% normally 5,7,10

We took away 5% base speed, and put it into diseased claw.

I cannot think of a good argument in regular Demigod to sink 2 or more points into diseased claw for normal builds... but now it is situational depending on itemization. Basically, when you are even in speed by itemization, you can option to uneven this by every point in diseased claw.

That is to say, in normal demigod, going from 5% to 7% snare does bupkis for you... in BalMod, 5% net snare is an escalation to stay caught. If they itemize equal speed or faster, you itemize diseased claw to keep them caught in a gank.

Pretty much points 1 and 2 go hand in hand. It helps eliminate Opness of kamikazi UB at "normal" levels of skill/play, while giving Pros options for situational points to spend on ganking.

3) Ooze...  40% attack speed reduction breaks auto-attack builds. This is a meta balance decision to enable AA builds in bal mod. It is not necessarily appropriate to these discussions since the meta in normal demigod does not really allow AA builds to be effective. 25% attack speed mitigation can be overcome with itemization and skills, and this is the reason for this change.

4) Acclimation 25% (down from 40%
My argument is that this amount is OP. Others argue it is not. My reason: Watch replays of a late game "pro" UBs who are granted Bulwark and Ashkandor by the team pooling their money.... it's pretty ridiculous.

5) Grasp II/III
I think this is the 1st post I have ever seen a pro player advocate taking this skill in normal Demigod (and I would love to see some replays of a pro game where someone took these skills).

I did this change from the conventional wisdom that Grasp is great because of the 2 second stun... but getting an extra 300 points in heal every 15 seconds for 2 skill points (one of them a level 15) is not great at all. (especially since most players break the grasp drain anyways as soon as they land it)

Bestial Wrath: Not really relevant here, but, the reason for the change.... Its duration is not long enough to really be used unless you are playing super awesome ooze beast (as seen in this guide). I don't see this used in any pro games, and in n00b games, you might as well put a point in Yetis... your team will mock you, and then discon for being such a n00b to have taken this skill.

Sorry to stray a bit off topic... but hopefully that clarifies my position.

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February 22, 2012 12:03:27 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting pacov,
You forgot to add in jtreads. Only person maybe catching u at that point is da.
good point i wanted to do an artifact chapter, I think there is a lot more of deep insight i can share than most people are able to experience with no high lvl players left to have long games against.

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February 22, 2012 12:09:41 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting JUSThaveFUN,
good point i wanted to do an artifact chapter

well - you can add an artifact chapter, but even that is generally outside the scope of pro games.  Sure, some do hit artifacts, but common?  nah.  Anyway, why not.  Make your guide as exhaustive as possible.  No reason that you shouldn't have fun with it. 

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February 22, 2012 12:30:43 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting JUSThaveFUN,
Just as the capturing gold flag without getting hit by the turret is accepted.

Was this not meant to happen in the map design for cata?

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February 22, 2012 2:51:22 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting doggu,

Quoting JUSThaveFUN, reply 67 Just as the capturing gold flag without getting hit by the turret is accepted.

Was this not meant to happen in the map design for cata?
nope, they said they were going to fix it but never did.

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February 22, 2012 2:55:24 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting pacov,

Quoting JUSThaveFUN, reply 70good point i wanted to do an artifact chapter

well - you can add an artifact chapter, but even that is generally outside the scope of pro games.  Sure, some do hit artifacts, but common?  nah.  Anyway, why not.  Make your guide as exhaustive as possible.  No reason that you shouldn't have fun with it. 

yeah in pro games it can get max to 1 or 2 artifact games on cataract. But like weighting when to get which artifact is a skill you only learn playing a lot of late game games. And zikkurat is like the best map to play with a lot of artifacts, and 4v4 actually works if everyone has good internet and simspeed.

I probably will add the j treads in there and other stronger items that are artifact like

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February 22, 2012 7:37:10 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting JUSThaveFUN,
I'm just naming my strategies that had the highest win percentage from over 1k UB games spread on 3 different accounts and worked the best for me, and made me win 4-5 tournaments.

Quoting JUSThaveFUN,
I'm purely focusing on the best case scenarios where no one makes a mistake all game.

 

Ahahaha Zen, come on now.  First of all, you won 4-5 tournaments?  You won the first 2 v 2 tournament where you played TB and Oak not UB.  Also if I remember correctly you won one of the mini 3 v 3 tournament with Orcun and Renz who everyone knows could rotate in up to 10 different people as a third and still win.  

And next, best case scenarios where no one makes a mistake all game don't happen.  Even in the greatest game ever played, http://www.gamereplays.org/demigod/replays.php?game=51&show=details&id=163978 there were plenty of mistakes.  

Also nnnils is just flat out better than everyone now, so saying you know better than him because you've had one million games and played in (not won) 4-5 tournaments is ridiculous.

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