XP boosts, how helpful are they?

By Zechnophobe on October 14, 2009 2:33:36 AM from

Level	Base	10%	20%	30%	40%	50%
1	0	0	0	0	0	0
2	200	220	240	260	280	300
3	500	550	600	650	700	750
4	900	990	1080	1170	1260	1350
5	1400	1540	1680	1820	1960	2100
6	2150	2365	2580	2795	3010	3225
7	3025	3327.5	3630	3932.5	4235	4537.5
8	4025	4427.5	4830	5232.5	5635	6037.5
9	5150	5665	6180	6695	7210	7725
10	6400	7040	7680	8320	8960	9600
11	7775	8552.5	9330	10107.5	10885	11662.5
12	9275	10202.5	11130	12057.5	12985	13912.5
13	10900	11990	13080	14170	15260	16350
14	12650	13915	15180	16445	17710	18975
15	14525	15977.5	17430	18882.5	20335	21787.5
16	16525	18177.5	19830	21482.5	23135	24787.5
17	18650	20515	22380	24245	26110	27975
18	20900	22990	25080	27170	29260	31350
19	23275	25602.5	27930	30257.5	32585	34912.5
20	25775	28352.5	30930	33507.5	36085	38662.

This is the Lua table that defines how much experience you need to get to a given level. As you can see, the numbers increase rather quick... but we can use this to figure out exactly how valuable something is. For instance, the first experience upgrade from the citadel gives +10% experience.

EDIT: I have now made it into more of a table. The BASE columns shows how much XP you would have at that point in the game without an XP bonus. Each column increases XP gain by 10%. Color dictates where you get full bonus levels, where Orange = 1, Red = 2, and Purple = 3.

Note that +10% Experience never gives you a full level, the entire game. 20% Experience will never get more than 1 level ahead, and will do so at about level 10, etc etc.

These numbers assume the fictiotious scenario WHERE YOU HAVE THE XP BOOST FROM THE BEGINNING OF THE GAME. This is not something you can actually with anything but the brilliant bauble. These are actually then higher than the actual in game numbers you could possibly get.

Just thought people might like to know

+57 Karma | 71 Replies

Whoever controls the field is going to level faster the majority of the time. Prison is one of the few possible exceptions. For the majority of games I have certain baseline pieces of equipment that I will hold off on this kind of upgrade indefinitely for.

@ Maccilia

thx for the replay.

Some of the pro-xp upgrade comments here don't make sense.

Look at the table again. Forget about whether or not the other side buys priest upgrades, etc. If you buy the first xp upgrade, you gain no level advantage through out the course of the game by virtue of having that upgrade. You will get levels faster than your opponents, but you will not be more than one level above them at any given time by virtue of the upgrade. If you have the second xp upgrade, you get one full level advantage, and that's going to be at level 11 or later (most likely later, since you're not getting xp at level one).

OK, I understand you can get the xp flag on cataract and add that to xp. But you can still get the benefit of that without buying xp 1. And if you hold the xp flag the whole time and have the spare gold to buy xp1, you would probably have won the game anyway regardless of whether you actually bought xp1 or not.

I understand that if the enemy buys priests early, you can farm them. But you get most of this benefit even without xp1.

Another way of stating it is: if you are two or more levels above your opponents, it is certainly not because you bought xp upgrades. It's because your team is better than theirs. They are likely feeding you with troops and kills. Your level advantage is not caused by the xp upgrades. Had you not gotten the upgrades, you still would be outleveling them by almost the same amount. You probably could have bought the death penalty mitigation upgrade instead of xp and still won.

I already thought the XP upgrade wasn't worth the price, but this table shows that it's even worse than I thought. It's good evidence for a possible boost in the future.

Awesome post, thank you.

It is amazing to see so many wierd arguments that is against the original statement. It looks damn obvious that xp upgrade suck.

Have to agree with the last few.... I dont know how people can say 1 level advantage is game winner.... It helps yes... but map control is far more favourable.... I rather hold off xp and get currency and the starting items I require... because IMO... its those who get those items first will be in better position.... if you want into battle with 1 level advantage say at best... but your lacking say 500 hp from a basic item.... well that 1 extra skill isn't going to add 500 hp + some health regen...

Like others say... its situational... but my primary goal is to get my hp up to respectable levels so I dont have to run away... and then get my mana up, followed by whatever 4rth and 5th item I see fit.

Perhaps I'm thinking backwards, but I always thought of the XP Upgrades as a method of minimising an enemies lead rather than a strategy to 'get ahead'. On Cata, for example, if my opponent is keeping the XP Flag locked down, I'll grab our XP upgrade to minimise the positive benefits of them doing this.

Some of the pro-xp upgrade comments here don't make sense.

Look at the table again. Forget about whether or not the other side buys priest upgrades, etc. If you buy the first xp upgrade, you gain no level advantage through out the course of the game by virtue of having that upgrade. You will get levels faster than your opponents, but you will not be more than one level above them at any given time by virtue of the upgrade. If you have the second xp upgrade, you get one full level advantage, and that's going to be at level 11 or later (most likely later, since you're not getting xp at level one).

OK, I understand you can get the xp flag on cataract and add that to xp. But you can still get the benefit of that without buying xp 1. And if you hold the xp flag the whole time and have the spare gold to buy xp1, you would probably have won the game anyway regardless of whether you actually bought xp1 or not.

I understand that if the enemy buys priests early, you can farm them. But you get most of this benefit even without xp1.

Another way of stating it is: if you are two or more levels above your opponents, it is certainly not because you bought xp upgrades. It's because your team is better than theirs. They are likely feeding you with troops and kills. Your level advantage is not caused by the xp upgrades. Had you not gotten the upgrades, you still would be outleveling them by almost the same amount. You probably could have bought the death penalty mitigation upgrade instead of xp and still won.

Couldn't have said things better.

Go buy Scaled Mail + Banded Armor + one Lock instead and get that middle flag back! Better for WS.

the real question here is wether the benefit of buying xp1 (& 2) is greater, smaller or equal to the benefit of buying extra items with the gold instead

personally I go for items, xp might be better I don't know

there's no real way to prove this using maths either, since you can't express the advantage of an extra item / level in numbers

guess the only method left is a statistic research (have fun with that)

it's probably also game dependant, in some games the extra lvl will give a bigger advantage that the extra item, in others it won't

the real question here is wether the benefit of buying xp1 (& 2) is greater, smaller or equal to the benefit of buying extra items with the gold instead

personally I go for items, xp might be better I don't know

there's no real way to prove this using maths either, since you can't express the advantage of an extra item / level in numbers

True. I think, though, that equipment or consumables is always better than having a one level up for what is likely to be a short period of time against an equally skilled opponent. Well, actually, it's your whole team having that slight level advantage, but still.

No way to really prove it, but, intuitively anyway, would people rather have xp1 or Nimoth's Chest Armor? xp1 or 3 sigils? No question in my mind.

i have been called a noob for asking why one buoght xp1 upgrade at level 4. i didn't tried to explain why it is ibviously worthless.

no seriosly, the xp upgradea are worthless. the money is much better spend elsewhere, and there are quite many possibilities to spend on that are really nice.

I think the citadell upgrade you always should take is currency I, and currency II for 4v4 or bigger maps, and creeps eventually. Creep upgrades make sense once catas/giants are out.

I always thought that getting the first level or 2 of exp was a good idea if you knew that you would be able to hold the experience flag on cataract easily or were capping it.

Putting money in experience might be advised if you happen to be getting a lot of kills say so that the rest of your team benefits and you'll be able to keep your hold on the game later on as well as early on

I think this proves that the exp upgrade is a nice idea, just too expensive to implement

Maybe it would be better if they were made cheaper and changed to 15%, 30%, 50%, 75%, 100% ?

_Golgoth_ :

I always thought that getting the first level or 2 of exp was a good idea if you knew that you would be able to hold the experience flag on cataract easily or were capping it.

Putting money in experience might be advised if you happen to be getting a lot of kills say so that the rest of your team benefits and you'll be able to keep your hold on the game later on as well as early on

Jomungur :

OK, I understand you can get the xp flag on cataract and add that to xp. But you can still get the benefit of that without buying xp 1.

if you are two or more levels above your opponents, it is certainly not because you bought xp upgrades. It's because your team is better than theirs. They are likely feeding you with troops and kills.

Everything has been said, no? XP sounds like overkill and got minor impact on games (maybe even a disadvantage due to money loss in close game?)

We always get xp 1 and currency immedieatly, because we play a long term game. We farm all of our creeps, don't depend on early kills, conserve our cash, and then dominate flag control late game against any opponents who didn't do the same, and we get catas as soon as we hit 8 and giants as soon as we hit 10. Opponents who use consumables early - like sigils - can't keep up in the long run.

There's a huge difference between clever and stupid usage of consumables. Using lots of TP at beginning of a game is bad, put yourself in dangerous situation and being forced to use these Health pots is bad, constant flag locking very early game is bad. This would result in lot of cash gone for very little advantage, you're right. But if you face strong players, this won't be the same. Be sure my 500 gold Sigil get me one kill most of the time, sometimes two.

While you buy xp1 (which will give you around 0 level advantage all game - look at table), I'll get Health / Armor / Consumables which will allow me to push you off flag (getting WS), sometimes force you to RTB (making you lose xp and gold), and rarely kill you if you're too confident.

As was said repeatedly earlier, 10% level boost means that you hit the next level QUICKER, and that is never more huge than in the beginning of the game. Hitting level 2 spit before they do means I can push them back. The person who buys XP1 is going to be under-itemized, but it will help his team mates greatly.

there's no real way to prove this using maths either, since you can't express the advantage of an extra item / level in numbers

Yeodan was right. No way to prove anything, and everyone feel his mind is right. Let's just all play the way we want

Quoting FutileEmotion,

reply 42

First to grasp

First to boulder 2

First to surge 2

First to bat swarm

First to mines 3

First to Shield 3

Every little bit helps

Quoting playgroundlegend,

reply 44

Quoting FutileEmotion,
reply 42
As was said repeatedly earlier, 10% level boost means that you hit the next level QUICKER, and that is never more huge than in the beginning of the game. Hitting level 2 spit before they do means I can push them back. The person who buys XP1 is going to be under-itemized, but it will help his team mates greatly.

First to grasp

First to boulder 2

First to surge 2

First to bat swarm

First to mines 3

First to Shield 3

Every little bit helps

unless the enemy pushes you back first because they have more health / damage from their items

unless the enemy pushes you back first because they have more health / damage from their items"

Only the guy who bought Expierence, who will be deadweight for about 3 minutes. However, it's going to be the exact same thing for the other team, when they buy Currency. Or are you implying that you shouldn't buy currency either because it under-itemizes you?

Just because you are underitemized doesn't mean you lose XP. There are two waves. You have 3 DG. Any decent team will manage to get almost all of that xp, no matter how itemized they are.

I'm not buying it. Getting some abilities a little earlier is nice, but so is another 600 health or mana on one of your teammates. So is buying a teleport scroll for everyone on your team, and maybe a couple locks. You will get more experience by having better gear for longer. Not much likely, but probably at least... 10%? A wave spawns every 30 seconds, You get 11 Waves in 3:30. If you get just one more waves worth of kills because of that 1200 gold, you are already getting the same benefit as xp 1.

Hm.

The disagreement on this thread actually shows that the XP upgrade is fine as it is.

Many people think it's an advantage, many think it isn't. Which imho is the best thing for any ingame mechanic. If almost everybody agreed that it's an advantage (like Currency 1 or giants first) then maybe it would be too good.

Here's the thing. You can point to the numbers on Currency II and III and conclude definitively that they aren't worth it. That's because gold is a baseline - the upgrade doesn't react to events ingame so you can calculate it to the farthing and say it's inefficient.

You can't make a similar chart for the XP upgrade and come to any meaningful conclusion. XP isn't received in a steady trickle. The XP upgrade is reactive - it applies only in relation to the experience you are receiving through your actions in play. In that sense, it's the only upgrade that directly corresponds to how good you are as a player.

For example: upgrading xp makes sense even if just from a portal cap perspective. Control mid, upgrade xp every chance you get, and when you cap an enemy portal the already great enemy portal bonus becomes ludicrous.

It's part of why you see games where one team has a collective 12 levels over the other, and it's really hard to pin that down on a chart..

(Do we know if the upgrade percentage compounds? I figure it wouldn't in a sane mechanic but thought I'd check...)

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XP boosts, how helpful are they?