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Lord Erebus.

By on August 12, 2009 3:26:06 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Needs a nerf. I don't care how. But he needs one.

Pretty much all the games I have played recently have had at least one Erebus in, and I don't know what the hell is going on because I never had problems with them before, but at the moment with max minions, max bite, 1 point in swarm and 1 point in stun there is NOTHING you can do against it. It totally owns from level 2 until the game finishes and you simply cannot touch him.

I CAN'T EVEN MAKE THEM LOSE ANY HP, AND THE DPS THEY HAVE IS INSANE.

/rage

 

+7 Karma | 192 Replies
August 13, 2009 12:57:09 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Erebus is a bitch. No doubt about that. But if you can AoE down his minions (which is a lot easier without Horn of Battle), there's not many options left for him but to retreat.

I've never seen it in action, but I could see AoE stuns working on minion Erebus too. TB's Ice Nova can stun minions for 10 seconds I think? That's a pretty long stretch during which Erebus will have lost most of his DPS...

Erebus with Bat Swarm is really good at avoiding death. There are counters, though. The most effective would probably be Sedna's Silence. If you can get him right before he swarms, the kill is yours for the taking. Most Erebuses take it for granted that Bat Swarm will get them out of nearly any situation. Reg's Snipe is great for finishing him off, too.

August 13, 2009 1:11:33 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting Hack78,

Quoting gkrit, reply 23i too have vsed a few erebus recently, that have been almost impossible to kill. They evade too much, move to fast, stack health alot. with all that goignon he still moves fast, so i dunno wtf items they get. So i decided to do an evasive build myself, man was that was a failure and a half.

but i dont think he needs to be nerfed. ppl have just found his highest potential. time to do so for the rest.

Ryan is a real @#^%% with erb isn't he...

 

 

 

Erebus was so 2 weeks ago, now im goin through my Rook stage, FEAR MY MIGHTY HAMMERRRRR

August 13, 2009 1:51:48 AM from Stardock Forums Stardock Forums

[quote who="[ShakeNBake]" reply="17" id="2335599"]it was in pantheon and my team-mate rook was doing some pro feeding. but even so, i had good items, my solid slam build, and i felt confident, yet every time i tried to take on the erebus he TOTALLY destroyed me. i barely even did any dmg. he had no skill whatsoever, just bite and click my hero. he didnt even attempt to avoid slams. i had 6k hp and he had 4k. and i couldn't touch him. i tried out the erebus build in single player and went on a monster killing spree.

i didnt think tower build was any good vs minion builds because the towers never focus the right target, so i always go slam.

i just played a custom game as UB (+oak) vs erebus (+reg). again my team-mate did a bit of early game feeding. but i was ready to unleash a pro spit + ooze + parasite egg build this time. we won, but it was VERY VERY difficult to get a kill, there was no way it should have been that hard, and we were trading kills thoughout the game. the game ended at level 19. on prison.

in my eyes, minion bite erebus has EVERYTHING you could possibly need in a game of demigod. high move speed, a slow, an armor debuff, healing minions, heals through bite, tonnes of dps through minions and lifesteal (lvl 15). it can outlast ANY other demigod in the game without needing to go back to base. if you fail to kill it as an assassain, he will be back to full hp in no time.


it just feels way way way too strong, to play as, or against.

i might just play erebus or ub next pantheon and that will put an end to these QQ threads at least.
[/quote]

 

I agree with much of what you have siad in this thread, but the fact that you went on a huge killing spree in SP is a completely invalid point.

August 13, 2009 3:51:49 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

I am playing Erebus since I bought the game and started playing. I think you are absolutely right that this character is a bit too strong. Maybe its just because I am not playing any other caracter and improved my skills with this to the best I know so far. All I can say is if you really manage to have a good start in the game erebus is nearly unstoppable 1vs1.

I guess this is because he has some defensive skills other demigods does not have. And even if it looks worse its not that easy to kill him like other demigods. But this is only if you can use ur special skills in a propper way. For example when beast spites acid on me, you just have use mist ability and you are no longer suffering on poisonous damage for example. Or when Tower Demigod does his finishing move with his hammer move into mist. In this I expierienced that Erebus seems not to take that much damage unclean beast or others demigods does. THis seems to be definitely an error. Additionally with the right equipment it gets more implausibe that he dies. But as I expirienced for the other demigods its quite the same.

I am only playing on LAN and mostly against KI. As far I changed some starting options for the game. And expierienced that KI is far more better if you change to HIGH starting gold.Even with Erebus its very very difficult to kill a Demigod and if others are 1 LVL higher its nearly impossible.

I agree that Erebus is moving a bit to fast. For such a strong hero.

There is an additional bug/feature which might have already come to notice. This is when using the heart recharging 3000health and mana and then going into mist. This will recharge your mana and give you additional time about 10sec to stay in mist and recharge your abilities.

greetz

joh

August 13, 2009 7:40:55 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

well in most games I have problems with them, it's almost always because my team-mate goes running out of base as soon as the game starts, charges the 1st demigod he sees, gets bitten and tries to run, 6.3 move speed on erebus owns his face.

erebus + ub is a nasty combo, because they are both fast, and if they both focus a target it is gonna be dead in seconds early game. however this doesn't stop my ally going charging away miles from towers to try and take them 1v2...

a problem with such powerful demigods early game is that they will have early flag control, and if that involves a gold or exp flag (prison for instance) then you are not ever going to be able to stand up to them in a game EVER...

WTB less suicidal team-mates i guess.

August 13, 2009 10:31:24 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

He is a bit too strong if you play him correctly. More importantly he is hard to counter, especially for rook. Everybody has a nemesis (almost) but sometimes it is a bit too easy to kill rook. A nerf would probably be in it's place, or the others can get some kind of buff.

August 13, 2009 11:21:52 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Being an almost exclusive assasin Eberus player (no minions), I must confess that with enough mana I feel confident to engage anything and chase him down without hesitating, I will only use minions as a last resort, so yes I agree Ereb is a bit overpowered with the whole minions thing.

August 13, 2009 12:28:54 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Even after the bite nerf, that skill is still out of whack.

The only comparable skill is Oaks Penitence.

Bite costs less, heals and slows more.

The only thing it doesn't have is the interrupt.

 

Personally I would remove or severely reduce the crippling speed debuff from it.

At later levels it is just sick. Bat Swarm then bite then melee equals one dead DG.

August 13, 2009 12:35:09 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting Esuzu,
He is a bit too strong if you play him correctly. More importantly he is hard to counter, especially for rook. Everybody has a nemesis (almost) but sometimes it is a bit too easy to kill rook. A nerf would probably be in it's place, or the others can get some kind of buff.

Sigh. Stop thinking of this game as a 1v1 game. Its not! Its a team game!

August 13, 2009 1:13:37 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Sigh. Stop thinking of this game as a 1v1 game. Its not! Its a team game!

I completely agree with your statement - Demigod IS in fact a team game, but: if you are suggesting Erebus needs to be beaten 2v1, then that rather points out that he has a few balancing tweaks in order. 

If you are saying he's more manageable in a 2v2 (Demigods A+B vs. C+Erebus) scenario, that still ends up being A+B vs Erebus, or in the case of A vs Erebus and B vs C, Demigod A (without some backup) will likely get stomped.

EDIT: That said, I do feel like there are other Demigods out there when specced right almost demand a 2v1 scenario (like a well put together Sedna, say). Of course, I'm far from the greatest DG player in the world, so what do I know?

August 13, 2009 1:59:29 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Sigh. Stop thinking of this game as a 1v1 game. Its not! Its a team game!

 

Play vs 5 Minion EBs, and you have your team game.

August 13, 2009 1:59:56 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

One big issue with Erebus's minions against Rook is that they can be placed directly under his feet where it's impossible to Hammer Slam.  Rook is too slow to effectively position himself to slam the minions.  Worse, if you slam too close to yourself, Rook just stands there and does nothing.  Further, towers end up splitting all of their firepower amongst the minions.  Even if you had 8 towers up, his minions swarm can run around comfortably in your farm because they're probably zapping 8 different minions. 

I'd love it so much if you did a slam under your feet as Rook, he'd just stomp his feet and do the same amount of damage.

Thinking about it, what makes UB and Erebus 'overpowered' is that they have no real weaknesses.  They're both fast, have a stun, have great HP, great DPS ability, slow, and healing.  Erebus has minions.  UB has ooze.  Erebus has swarm, UB has a 'stun' that doesn't proc as a stun.  And so on.  Oak also doesn't have a noticeable weakness, but at least he's got average speed.  But other DGs have specific weaknesses.  Rook is slow, Sedna has no AoE and low DPS, TB and Reg have low HP, QoT is, well, QoT.

 

August 13, 2009 2:10:57 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

TB? 

 

For the rest I think you are very close here, UB is very powerfull early game with spit, becomes a monster in mid game and doesn't stop getting better in endgame. He is also very easy and straightforward to play, easist Demigod by far.

Erebus does have some weaknesses, low hp not so great dps, but his skills are all very good and flexible. Indeed he has it all: speed/slow area stun, health swing(bite) teleport, minions, dispell(mist). But he also needs to choose between a lot of good skills, while UB doesnt(Bestial wrath...). I'm not sure if erebus is insanely OP, but they both seem to be an insanely good counter to squishies(ie regulus and TB). Some tweaking might be in order.

August 13, 2009 3:13:04 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting lifekatana,
TB? 

 

Oops, type.  Fixed

August 13, 2009 3:29:04 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting Polynomial,



Quoting Esuzu,
reply 31
He is a bit too strong if you play him correctly. More importantly he is hard to counter, especially for rook. Everybody has a nemesis (almost) but sometimes it is a bit too easy to kill rook. A nerf would probably be in it's place, or the others can get some kind of buff.


Sigh. Stop thinking of this game as a 1v1 game. Its not! Its a team game!

Ok, while I generally agree with this, if one demigod is simply better in a 1v1, and this doesn't change for higher numbers (2v2, 3v3 etc) then it is clearly overpowered. Explain a bit. If Erebus has to be 2v1'd to be forced out of a lane, than it seems that would make him a bit strong to me (especially given that's he fast, so he can switch lanes to support as well).

 

August 13, 2009 5:23:39 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Ok, while I generally agree with this, if one demigod is simply better in a 1v1, and this doesn't change for higher numbers (2v2, 3v3 etc) then it is clearly overpowered. Explain a bit. If Erebus has to be 2v1'd to be forced out of a lane, than it seems that would make him a bit strong to me (especially given that's he fast, so he can switch lanes to support as well).
Polynomial doesn't believe 3v3 is a valid game type so he isn't interested in the fact that in a 3v3 you being forced to go 2v1 on one side leaves your other side open to a 2v1.

August 13, 2009 5:41:11 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

When have I said 3v3 is an invalid game type?

And why do people think Erebus is unkillable?

August 13, 2009 6:14:01 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

I don't want to be rude but Polynomial needs to shut up. He has cited his mantra that there are no balance issues in the game in every thread now.  A team composed of Rook/TB/Qot will not win against Erebus/Sedna/UB on even skill..ever. I agree with Poly that the bulk of these threads are whiny threads about some perceived imbalance that has more to do with skill differences than game mechanics BUT again this does not mean the game is balanced perfectly. And I thus ask you all to discuss this as gentlemen.

 

 

 

 

 

August 13, 2009 6:33:48 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting lifekatana,
I don't want to be rude but Polynomial needs to shut up. He has cited his mantra that there are no balance issues in the game in every thread now.  A team composed of Rook/TB/Qot will not win against Erebus/Sedna/UB on even skill..ever. 
I know it's beside the point, but I actually disagree with you here. Rook/QoT is an amazing combo. Rook/QoT/TB would annihilate minions like nobody's business too.

August 13, 2009 7:05:19 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting lifekatana,
I don't want to be rude but Polynomial needs to shut up. He has cited his mantra that there are no balance issues in the game in every thread now.  A team composed of Rook/TB/Qot will not win against Erebus/Sedna/UB on even skill..ever. I agree with Poly that the bulk of these threads are whiny threads about some perceived imbalance that has more to do with skill differences than game mechanics BUT again this does not mean the game is balanced perfectly. And I thus ask you all to discuss this as gentlemen.

You see, the problem is if no one is around to point out why X does not need to nerf GPG is going to think X needs a nerf because everyone and their mother is whining about it. And everyone knows when GPG balances something whether its Demigod or SupCom, its usually a radical change. I like this game too much to let every noobish whipper snapper create a false sense that this game has serious balance issues. Demigod's balance out of the box was a rarity and probably complete stroke of luck. No one needs nerfing, only some boosting.

 

August 13, 2009 10:04:38 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting Polynomial,

Quoting lifekatana, reply 43I don't want to be rude but Polynomial needs to shut up. He has cited his mantra that there are no balance issues in the game in every thread now.  A team composed of Rook/TB/Qot will not win against Erebus/Sedna/UB on even skill..ever. I agree with Poly that the bulk of these threads are whiny threads about some perceived imbalance that has more to do with skill differences than game mechanics BUT again this does not mean the game is balanced perfectly. And I thus ask you all to discuss this as gentlemen.
You see, the problem is if no one is around to point out why X does not need to nerf GPG is going to think X needs a nerf because everyone and their mother is whining about it. And everyone knows when GPG balances something whether its Demigod or SupCom, its usually a radical change. I like this game too much to let every noobish whipper snapper create a false sense that this game has serious balance issues. Demigod's balance out of the box was a rarity and probably complete stroke of luck. No one needs nerfing, only some boosting.

 

 

 

Agreed, only person they should make stronger is QoT, thats all, no1 needs 2 b weaker, ppl just need 2 b SMARTER at the game, unfortunatly this world is full of un smart ppl

August 13, 2009 11:39:57 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

You see, the problem is if no one is around to point out why X does not need to nerf GPG is going to think X needs a nerf because everyone and their mother is whining about it. And everyone knows when GPG balances something whether its Demigod or SupCom, its usually a radical change. I like this game too much to let every noobish whipper snapper create a false sense that this game has serious balance issues. Demigod's balance out of the box was a rarity and probably complete stroke of luck. No one needs nerfing, only some boosting.
If GPG just reads the forums and implements player suggest buffs or nerfs, the game is done for anyway. They should be evaluating actual gameplay and, while not basing it solely off of them, using performance statistics as well. They're going to tweak balance, add new items, DGs, and maps no matter how much you decry change. Balancing has to be done, unless everything inserted in a 100% polished form and there isn't even ripple on the oh so serene surface of DG's balance... and if the stuff added is that perfect, if the game was perfect at release, and if it's still perfect after several patches which have affected balance, then maybe your hypothesis about it all being dumb luck should be tossed out the window and you shouldn't fear GPG screwing up the game to appease forum-goers.

Your mantra has been "everything's fine," but you've provided no helpful feedback in the last few threads we've gone back and forth over. If someone says Erebus is too strong you should offer a more helpful explanation than "not in team games!" I realize you can't write out a four page strategy guide every time someone cries nerf, but at least giving some basic pointers or explanation about why exactly problem A or B or C isn't a problem at all would be much more productive.

This is the worst example of your replies:

TO START. His base move speed definitly needs knocking down to 6.0
That way you can at least attempt to run away from his minions.

(At the moment, as rook, even if you were to take a +15% move speed item, you would still be at 6.2 and unable to escape him or his minions without a teleport - which he will probably stun, and if you fake cast, you'll be dead before you can cast it again).

Stacking armor seems to not work vs minion bite erebus.
Stacking hp             ^
Stacking hp regen    ^
Stacking life steal    ^
Stacking damage     ^

I seriously cannot think of a counter to this build. It can outlast all other demigods in the game - then chase them down.
Can anyone give me a viable counter to it?
Especially as a rook, but as any demigod at all would be a start.

 Here's your response:

That's because you are thinking the wrong way. This is not a 1v1 game. This is a team game.

He took time to show that he's been experimenting and working to defeat this, and your response is a truly unhelpful one-liner. Do you really think that a rank 250 player who's played hundreds of games doesn't realize this is a team game? I don't know if you're doing it intentionally or not, but you really are just trolling right now.

August 14, 2009 12:07:10 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Rook with stacked armor and Blade of the Serpent merely needs hammer slam to 1) destroy all the minions around him and 2) gain lots of mana..

 

Add in the two lifetap rings and you get a nice chunk of life out of the arrow towers shooting the endless supply of + HPs for you..

You don't need weapon upgrades as rook.  With Armor and Speed items you should be able to judge when to stay and when to go v lord erebus..

 

 

August 14, 2009 1:07:18 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

I normally play 3v3s basically due to the time I'm on and my location. I've played against teams, that may not have been premades but have done some great teamwork like scrolling to gold flags/portals, capping our flags together, trying to ambush/trap our team etc. But when I played with basically 2 random people, and I went LE, they just got pushed back quite easily. At one stage I even killed all 3 (one was sedna) while protecting the portal flag we just capped.

Normally I play Reg and can sometimes fend off the bad LE players, but the half decent ones, I basically just run from and mine spam to hold em back, I don't even attempt to take them on alone, even 2vs1 they mostly end up getting away easily due to stuns/bats.

I think they have too many great abilities. Bite, Bat Swarm, Mist, the regen bonuses etc, and thats not to mention the minions. If you chase them with 2 or more, they'll just run away or try to take one of yas out and get away anyway since they can just stun and run, or bat swarm or even mist to buy time for allies to come. Though there is nothing like forcing a low hp LE to mist and putting 3 mines under him

August 14, 2009 1:11:11 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Lugh I found that even stacking Speed items on Rook, once you are bitten you cannot escape from Erebus! Bite lowers speed :/ Usually I speed away before he bite me lol.

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