yah

Not necessarily talking about multiplayer success in terms of how the actual match up are exectued but in new content.  I know there are going to be more Demigods but I just wish there could be some kind of user content creation.  Also C.C is right Battle.net is a pretty good example of longetivity and how to execute.  Warcraft 3 has lasted a long time so there has got to be a better example of the point you are trying to make.  Anyways what do you guys think about a map editor or something like that.  I mean doesn't even have to do with making custom skills or anything just simple maps would be nice.  I know they are going to allow a ton of changing game rules but I think user created content is what brings games to a whole new level.

Haha, I like your optimism but I still don't understand what is fundimentally wrong.  Who wouldn't want a good multiplayer system?  That is the whole point of this discussion what does a good system mean to you?

My understanding is that one person's idea simply are not enough to really make something truly fun and ground breaking. This is why I constantly desire to reach out to the community in a constructive way, a way which doesn't say 'No that idea is bad, taken, this one is better' etc. I will once again express my primary focus:

I do think about my dad a lot when it comes to playing a game like this online. He's been very, very put off from RTS games because of how quickly they play and how aggressive the community can be. He enjoys the games, and wants to enjoy them with people of his level of play skill and pacing. For instance, he likes to make slow and careful choices - likely he will do terribly against an expert, even someone like me who makes choices much faster than him and works at a game and furthermore practices at it.

So no, I'm not looking to make a system that is fully comfortable for someone just like him, but he's always there in my mind to remind me that there are many people out there like him that do not want to play this game in a super hardcore fashion, and I know very well that ladders and multimatching furthermore puts them off, and drives them away from the game. There are lots of different ways to set up a system where people of all levels can not only player Tournaments, but also take part in thoses which are of their level and play skill.

Fact: Ladders and Win/Loss ratios do constribute to bad behavior. Note, I said bad behavior, this can mean a lot of things. To clarify, one such instance of bad behavior is that players do judge others players on their Win/Loss ratio and in many games this ultimately results in whether or not you take part in a game. This dates back aaaaaaaaaaaaaalll the way to StarCraft's first appearance on Battle.net, and ever before that when people would kick people just because they had poor scores. This continues even to this day, and there is no denying that is a part of gaming community, even beyond the RTS genre.

 Fact: Ladders put off players because they feel as though they'll be able to attain a certain standard in the game. And that standard is often achieved by someone who plays almost everyone waking moment of every day. If there is a ladder system, it should be restricted only to the current game in progress - such as the two to three month Tournaments Mike spoke about on the video interview.

      - Inverse, Ladders also inspire the hardcore gamings to play until they reach the top. And they take pride in being one of, or the best of all. Players can still attain this feeling from restricted ladders in Tournaments however.

I alone do not have all the answers, but I do have good ideas. It will take a long time for me to illustrate those ideas, that is the only reason why I haven't do so already.

As I stated, I'd clearly illustrate my ideas for a sollution if people supported the foundations of where I'm coming from.

Maybe they should have different bracketed tournaments based on win/loss ratios for example 10%-20%, 30%-40% and so on. With each bracket having a different reward for the winner. Also having the people in the higher bracket getting something better then the people in the lower brackets.

that'd ne nice I think except I think in order for it to properly place u before u entter a bracket u play 2 games. Through those 2 games it places u. This why if some one got alot better but just hasn't played alot while better still get placed equally but of course they cou;d lose the games on purpose hmmmm.

Yah and its not always your fault. Not to be mean but sometimes u have a noob on your team who isn't good so even though u are on a roll u still lose.

No, No, No, and No. Last Hitting is the worst thing you could possibly implement, bar a unique peripheral that jolts you with a few volts everytime you perform an action. It is inherently counter the very thing Demigod is built on - Teamwork.

I am confused what you don't like about last hitting.  I don't know it just seems to me like that would mean then that all you would do is go after the other Demigods and just constantly capture flags.  I could be totally wrong but it makes a little bit of sense to me well at least that you get gold for doing a lot of damage to creeps or killing them because then it rewards players who want to just kill the creeps.  Maybe alst hitting isn't the right way to do that maybe it should be done by the majority of damage.  I don't even know if it isn't already in the first beta but you need to rpovide incentives for players to kill enemy creeps I think at least.

Of course not only the person that kills creeps get experience.  Even in Dota you get experience of all creeps kill around you.  Anyways you can get experience from capturing flags and killing other Demigods.  I don't see where the incongruence is here, you aren't actually talking about that same thing I am talking about an extra incentive where you have to work a little bit for gold by getting gold from flag captures, creep kills, tower kills, or other things I am glad you get a constant gold depending on how many mines you have but you seem to think that last hitting creeps eliminates teamwork where on the otherhand it is one of the most important things when it comes to teamwork.  For instance in Dota it is all about lasthitting their creeps and denying you own.  As you usually have a lane partner you have to work in sync with them to focus certain creeps and not others and it is not just about your individual timing but a combined effort.  It doesn't necessarily need to be a huge amount of gold but I don't know I think that might be a step to reward people who are defending instead of constantly attacking and it adds more skill to the game.  By this I mean it makes you micromanage your character more which should always be a desired trait.  For a game to be fun it should have a lot of depth and last hitting makes it more complex.

1) We do have denying of some sort in Demigod already

2) We already have last-hitting (for Demigods only)

I admit that will be special situations instead of common ones in Dota but then I feeled that the normal "focusing fire to quickly reduce enemy firepower while preventing overkilling enemies" mechanic every RTS possesses is more suited for Demigod than the Dota mechanic. I mean attacking an enemy creep who has 1 hp left just to get the money instead of switching to another target and letting my own creeps finish him is something I never liked in Dota. Preventing to overkill enemies takes just as much skill as last-hitting and is a lot more intuitive.