Interesting article…MS and the “Dark Side”.

I've yet to see a compelling reason to switch to W10. Also that 10 years old insinuation I hope for his sake he was quoted out of context but I somehow doubt it...

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My GWX hasn't been affected yet on Windows 7 or 8 thank goodness. I do see though that occasionally, even though i have the update hidden, an update to Windows 10 file will appear in Windows Update, and I have to hide it again. There was even a new one the other day that hadn't been flagged that Microsoft tried to have no install. NO WAY MICROSOFT!! I triple boot, so I have Windows 10, I don't need you trying to force updates on my other OS's!

EXTREMELY POOR BUSINESS PRACTICE!

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They are also conducting a bit of passive aggressive warfare, in addition to the in-your-face-GWX crap. I no longer get a tray icon letting me know new security updates are available on my Win7 machines set to "Check for updates but let me choose..." Going on about 3 months now, maybe a bit longer. There must have been a stealth update along the way that disabled that function as it could only have been intentional. MS is truly being as obnoxious as they could be.

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Quoting Daiwa,

reply 3

I no longer get a tray icon letting me know new security updates are available on my Win7 machines set to "Check for updates but let me choose..." Going on about 3 months now, maybe a bit longer.

You're in the Home user group, so all updates are mandatory. Only the Enterprise group can delay installation for testing before deployment.

http://drjbhl.joeuser.com/article/468840/No_choice_mandatory_updates_for_W10_Home_users

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I thought those 'groups' only applied once upgraded to Win10, Doc, not to existing Win7 installations.

I'm on Win7 Pro; the updates are available to be installed if I go to Windows Update, I'm just no longer getting the tray icon notification that updates are available. Tray notifications have been the default in Win7 from the gitgo unless you choose "Never check for updates". At least until recently. Not a local machine issue as same behavior is occurring on all 3 of my Win7 Pro rigs. Again, just a passive-aggressive move by MS to just not quite fully support Win7, a little stone in the shoe for us Win7 folks.

I'm persuaded that part of their strategy is to make staying on Win7 a PIA by any means necessary ("support through 2020" be damned) and that those means will get steadily more overt & actively aggressive over time.

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BTW, there is another stealth Win10 upgrade 'update' in the latest batch - KB3112343 - to provide a 'better upgrade experience', of course. At least it's not labeled as a security update, but it's in the (allegedly) 'Important' batch.

Addendum:

5 of the Security updates in this batch refer to the same, completely vague security bulletin MS16-007 which tells you absolutely nothing about the updates.

I'll take off my TFH & get back to business now.

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Quoting hedetet,

reply 1

I've yet to see a compelling reason to switch to W10. Also that 10 years old insinuation

I hope for his sake he was quoted out of context but I somehow doubt it...

The only compelling reason I see is if you are a gamer and want the performance gains of DirectX12. If it weren't for that, I'd not even consider W10 at this point.

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Quoting Daiwa,

reply 5

I'm on Win7 Pro

Misunderstood your comment. Thought you were on W10...

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I've said it before, but I'll say it again. I'm riding Windows7 until it's no longer viable, then after that I'm done with Windows. More and more games are available on Linux and OSX, so I'm content to play there.

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I did the shop because Mark needed the spanking…lol. In truth, he’s been a great friend for yonks. I’m trying to convince him to at least give W10 a try.

It's not happening..... EVER. I got some Win 10 experience when I tweaked Shaunna's new laptop.... and frankly, that's enough for me. I don't like that MS changed things, moved things, renamed things, just for the sake of it. There was no logical reason, other than to make it look like a brand new OS. Nope, I plain don't like or trust it.

However, I will take the spanking if you pay for the dominatrix.

As for MS, dirty tricks and invasive Win 10 updates, they're not only despicable and obnoxious, they're fechen criminal. I decide what OS goes on my machines, not MS, and even though I've repeatedly rejected Win 10, they're forever trying to push it on me disguised as important/recommended updates. I keep hiding the damned things, but to no avail, the next round of updates contain another batch. I should NOT have to deal with this bullshit... having to check daily to see which kb item is yet another Win 10 update in disguise.

As far as I'm concerned, MS can go fech themselves. I will not go to Win 10.... and when Win 8.1 support is dropped, well they can stick w Windows up their.... where the sun don't shine.

+1

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Quoting starkers,

reply 10

As far as I'm concerned, MS can go fech themselves. I will not go to Win 10....

Ditto. I'll run Win 7 until it drops dead.

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Microsoft announced Intel's future processors Kaby Lake will not support Windows 7 and 8 only Windows 10.Wow! thats greedy MS.

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For those too young to remember ...

In 2001, Microsoft was indicted and CONVICTED of antitrust practices by bundling in MSIE with Windows as an anti-trust means of dominating rivals (Netscape Navigator, Opera, etc. -- this was before Firefox or Chrome) in the latter half of the 1990s, and caught -THREATENING- OEMs (computer hardware builders -- Dell, IBM, etc.) by making them pay more for Windows licenses if they didn't do as Microsoft demanded in forcing IE as a browser and not selling PCs with alternative OSes such as Linux.

Link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Microsoft_Corp.

However, "pro-business" Republicans started sweeping in and tearing out the anti-trust regulations that were put in place to bust up the market-stifling, anti-customer and anti-competitive monopolies of the late 19th to mid-20th centuries such as Standard Oil and Bell Labs (AT&T once basically owned all telecommunications throughout the entire country -- there were no separate regional phone companies, it was all a single monopoly). This same evisceration of antitrust trade laws also helped enable Enron to buy up energy assets, such as power production and distribution substations in California (though a lot of that was California state-specific deregulation, its arguable the same political maneuvering) which positioned them to artificially constrict the power supply by having its newly acquired production/distribution run "maintenance" (having several shut down), creating the infamous rolling brownouts of 2000/2001 in California; see: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_electricity_crisis

Anyway, this growing "pro-business" Republican (really anti-consumer) fuelled by monopolists (executives in giant corporations that have no real competition) and oligopolysts (very limited competition from a few well-entrenched titans prone to collusion) invested more and more into political campaigns, ads and media organizations to stir anti-government regulation sentiment against government regulation and oversight against public and market-unhealthy power exploiting/gouging consumers eventually brought about a nerf of Microsoft's conviction after it had been found guilty of anti-trust behavior.

Basically, big money guys swept into power and neutered the government trying to clamp down on a competition-stifling monopoly, so Microsoft while still convicted wound up with a slap on the wrist compared with the original fines.

And thus Microsoft knows it can pretty much get away with anything, and seems to have continued its pattern of "f--- you customers, we made sure you would not have alternatives, take what we give you" attitude they continue operating on today.

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Let's keep political prejudices out of the discussion.

Alternative is that it ends.

+1

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I'm ambivalent to win 10.

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Please don't confuse monopolistic activities to crush the competition with designing products to force you into doing things a certain way for your own good. It's a revolting abuse of logic, and, considering your obvious political leanings, intellectually dishonest.

Microsoft has done plenty of shady stuff, but packaging IE with Windows was as anti-competitive as putting ketchup in a squeeze bottle, and it's even less relevant to forcing unnecessary updates on you that delete software from your system without even a notification because they're potential security problems. They're not even a particularly crooked company, IBM was far worse when it had their position in the market, announcing products they weren't even working on to bankrupt small software companies before they could release and then buy them out. Apple is just all kinds of magical evilness today, they routinely file vague patents on other peoples work and then sue companies, who are some times the actual originators in the first place, that come anywhere near it.

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Quoting psychoak,

reply 16

Microsoft has done plenty of shady stuff, but packaging IE with Windows was as anti-competitive as putting ketchup in a squeeze bottle, and it's even less relevant to forcing unnecessary updates on you that delete software from your system without even a notification because they're potential security problems. They're not even a particularly crooked company, IBM was far worse when it had their position in the market, announcing products they weren't even working on to bankrupt small software companies before they could release and then buy them out. Apple is just all kinds of magical evilness today, they routinely file vague patents on other peoples work and then sue companies, who are some times the actual originators in the first place, that come anywhere near it.

What he said....

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Quoting Destrohelix,

reply 12

Microsoft announced Intel's future processors Kaby Lake will not support Windows 7 and 8 only Windows 10.Wow! thats greedy MS.

What's so damned despicable about this debacle is MS citing 'security concerns' with previous OSes. Several tech writers have denounced this move as scare tactics and quite dishonest. The truth is, MS wants everybody using Win 10, and will stop at nothing to make that happen. Well I have some bad news for MS, I'm switching to a Linux OS when support for Win 8.1 is taken off the table.

Quoting Chibiabos,

reply 13

Microsoft knows it can pretty much get away with anything, and seems to have continued its pattern of "f--- you customers, we made sure you would not have alternatives, take what we give you" attitude they continue operating on today.

Not in my world it isn't! I have no intention of being corralled in MS' version of a walled garden, or of copping forced updates up the arse, having everything I do on my PC recorded for whatever purposes MS chooses. No, and Apple is no better. Both companies have agendas that consider not the user, and neither can be trusted, less so now that MS has adopted Apple's business model.

Now that would be a turn up for the books. Apple has a patent on it and is currently looking to sue MS. With a bit of luck they'll drag it all out and bankrupt each other with impossible (to meet) legal fees.

Thing is, there are alternatives out there, and there will be plenty of Win 10 users switching to one of them when they get sick to the teeth of MS' bullying and standover tactics, being forced to cop shit they neither want or need. The fact that they keep reissuing Win 10 upgrades, often disguised as important and/or critical updates, to users who have already declined it several times is proof enough that MS does not and will not accept no for an answer. Just imagine what it will be like once trapped inside MS' most controllable OS, where they call the shots andensure users toe the MS line.

Anyone who wants that is welcome to it, but Windows beyond 8.1 is not for me. I will still use Win 8.1 when support ends, just not on a net-connected machine, just as I currently do with OS-X on my Mac Mini. Yeah, I got pissed that Apple used updates to delete various non- store apps and devices, so the Mac Mini got cut off from the net. Now when I want updates for it I download them on my main PC and move them over via data tranfer cable.

Quoting psychoak,

reply 16

Apple is just all kinds of magical evilness today, they routinely file vague patents on other peoples work and then sue companies, who are some times the actual originators in the first place,

Apple has been doing that for decades, claiming others material as its own, and now MS has adopted a very similar business model, don't be at all surprised to see it behaving in very much the same way. One company is as evil as the other now.... God forbid they ever joined forces.

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Quoting starkers,

reply 18

Not in my world it isn't! I have no intention of being corralled in MS' version of a walled garden, or of copping forced updates up the arse, having everything I do on my PC recorded for whatever purposes MS chooses. No, and Apple is no better. Both companies have agendas that consider not the user, and neither can be trusted, less so now that MS has adopted Apple's business model.

I honestly saw less than 0 appeal in downgrading from Windows 7 to 8, even 8.1. A higher version number is not an upgrade if it loses features I like and replaces them with others I find unappealing.

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Quoting Chibiabos,

reply 19

Quoting starkers,

reply 18

Not in my world it isn't! I have no intention of being corralled in MS' version of a walled garden, or of copping forced updates up the arse, having everything I do on my PC recorded for whatever purposes MS chooses. No, and Apple is no better. Both companies have agendas that consider not the user, and neither can be trusted, less so now that MS has adopted Apple's business model.

I honestly saw less than 0 appeal in downgrading from Windows 7 to 8, even 8.1. A higher version number is not an upgrade if it loses features I like and replaces them with others I find unappealing.

Yeah, alot of people didn't like Win 8 or 8.1, but I got my first copy for practically free and never looked back. Once Start8 was added there was little difference to running Win 7 for me. That doesn't mean to say I didn't like 7, just that I enjoy running 8 more. However, the 'downgrade' to 10 is not one I'm willing to make, not today, not ever.

Nope, if I'm gonna dabble with the 'Dark Side', it's gonna be with a domninatrix dressed in Darth Vader-like black leather.

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I recently downloaded Linux Mint - Cinnamon version. I want to see if I can run it while still having 8.1 and 10 on my laptop. One more toy to play with.

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Quoting psychoak,

reply 16

Microsoft has done plenty of shady stuff, but packaging IE with Windows was as anti-competitive as putting ketchup in a squeeze bottle,

It depends.

For people like you and me who have the knowledge and ability to select and download a different browser, it's not anti-competitive.

But for the vast majority of consumers who either don't know about alternative browsers and/or don't have the skills to choose an alternative, it is a defacto anti competitive move.

Consumer ignorance is not the fault of MS, but it's disingenuous to take advantage of it - just because it's legal.

Just because something is legal (or not explicitly illegal), doesn't make it ethical.

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Quoting Borg999,

reply 22

Just because something is legal (or not explicitly illegal), doesn't make it ethical.

Exactly, and Microsoft has crossed the line, using every legal or not explicity illegal method to foist Win 10 onto as many machines as it can.

Sadly, there is nobody in a position of authority in the US with the balls to pull MS up on its 'less than honest' tactics regarding Win 10.

When I say that I don't want Win 10, it don't mean I'm sitting on the fence, or that another more forceful 'offer' will make me change my mind. What it means, Microsoft, is that I DON'T Fechen want it.

Hopefully somebody over there at MS will read this and put an end to reissuing Win 10 upgrades/downloads to people who plain don't want it.

Get it through your thick heads, not everybody wants it.

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I switched to 8.1 and went to Windows update. There were 12 optional updates, no important or recommended ones. However I did find these...

KB3123862 - updated capabilities to put W10 on your machine...

KB2976978 (which was repeated a second time) - compatibility update to see if your machine can handle W10...

KB3035583 (sound familiar) - puts the 'get W10' app on your machine.

I hid them all. Pays not to have auto updates enabled. Lol

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Quoting Uvah,

reply 24

Pays not to have auto updates enabled.

Until you can't.

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Interesting article…MS and the “Dark Side”.

DrJBHL