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IP, monkey selfies, and now PETA.

By on December 6, 2015 6:21:49 AM from JoeUser Forums JoeUser Forums

DrJBHL

Join Date 04/2002
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David J. Slater is the photographer who set up a monkey selfie shot (in 2011) and when it became a meme, requested Wikipedia to remove the monkey selfie with a DCMA letter. Wiki said, sorry but the photo is uncopyrightable since current law says

“The term ‘authorship’ implies that, for a work to be copyrightable, it must owe its origin to a human being. Materials produced solely by nature, by plants, or by animals are not copyrightable.” – Copyright Compendium 202.02 b and c

So…the pics were obviously in the public domain…since even though he set up the picture, the monkey pushed the button.

But now? “PETA Strikes Back”, or rather, “Naruto Strikes Back”. They say his name is Naruto. Their lawyers actually filed (where else? San Francisco) a brief {irony: Check Sources number 2} defending the lawsuit which the lawyers actually claim is legit (in my eyes, the lawyers have ceased to be legit). You can see it here. It boils down to “Well, someone has to own it and it should be the monkey.” Lawyers having fun at the public expense. How about the Judge fining them $2 million for their PETA paid for publicity stunt? Never mind that Slater has been changing his story to expand his role in the idiotic photo. But the thought “There has to be a copyright and someone must hold it” is also wrong. The law actually says that photos/art created by humans or animals can be in the public domain and that therefore no one owns them.

Enough of this battle to entitle animals to stuff they aren’t entitled to from the get go. They have a right to some dignity, after all. What self respecting monkey, or other animal for that matter, would want to be a paparazzo?

How about this: Leave the animals alone where they live. Don’t destroy their environment: No amount of cosmetics justify destroying the world (it isn’t just where THEY live: It’s one planet). Go there and kill only time, and take only pictures (or paint, I don’t care). Then leave. Sell the pictures or not. The animals will have won, and so will we.

Now can we actually: 1) Defeat Daesh (ISIS). 2) Do something good for this mudball. 3) Stop preventing monkeys from being photographers and PLEASE, 4) End the “What Happened to Global Warming?” thread.

Sorry...could't resist the urge. So sue me.

Sources:

https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20151204/15044132991/selfie-monkey-strikes-back-lawyers-claim-course-monkeys-can-sue-copyright.shtml

https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/2641993/20151204Plaintiff27sOppositiontoMTD.pdf

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December 6, 2015 8:01:38 AM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

Hehe

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December 6, 2015 8:19:44 AM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

Just another day in the good, or rather not so good, world of wannabes and their fifteen minutes of fame.

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December 6, 2015 8:29:29 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

PETA is a menace to rational thought.

4) End the “What Happened to Global Warming?” thread.

Hear! Hear!

 

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December 6, 2015 9:15:54 AM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

Frankly, I don't see why monkeys can't take photos/selfies and own the copyrights to said materials. 

Then all David J Slater would have to do is become the monkey's legal guardian to sue on its behalf.

 

 

Oh, and Cauldyth, do you hold the copyright for the selfie that is your avatar?

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December 6, 2015 9:21:47 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting Cauldyth,

PETA is a menace to rational thought.


4) End the “What Happened to Global Warming?” thread.



Hear! Hear!

 

 

Assigning human inputs into Global warming trends is an error.  Obviously, we have finally uncovered the cause of global warming.  The monkeys are responsible.  There is a direct inverse correlation between the number of monkeys alive on the planet and rising climate (not weather) temperatures.  Therefore there is a connection between global warming thread and the PITA / monkey business. 

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December 6, 2015 10:18:00 AM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

Quoting starkers,

Frankly, I don't see why monkeys can't take photos/selfies and own the copyrights to said materials. 

You mean beyond the law dealing with it?

If you take it as a concept, it's absurd that a monkey which has no idea what a photograph/painting, etc. is, should have 'rights' to anything 'produced', really. To take it a step further, what would a monkey do with said 'rights'? Does a monkey have any conception of 'rights', or (more likely) is it a ploy to set PETA (or a bunch of lawyers) up with yet another source of income "administering" those rights and the funds and fees associated with the products? 

Imagine. A whole new field: Monkey (or elephant, whale, etc.) banking, financial services and the governmental aspect: Yes, taxes...more money for politicians, lawyers and bankers. Nah. Better to leave the monkeys to be monkeys wherever and the 'humans' to do what we do best...

Just to push a point.

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December 6, 2015 11:00:48 AM from Galactic Civilizations III Forums Galactic Civilizations III Forums


PLEASE, 4) End the “What Happened to Global Warming?” thread.

As long as there is no call to end the "Ban Game" thread I applaud.

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December 6, 2015 12:18:50 PM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

Here here......one is overplayed ad infinitum and the other injects humor into an otherwise banal world.

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December 6, 2015 12:32:43 PM from JoeUser Forums JoeUser Forums

I object, Uvah - they both inject humor into an otherwise banal world.

Leave the poor AGW thread alone.

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December 6, 2015 12:38:54 PM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

At least the monkey has lack of cognative ability to use an excuse for taking a selfie. What excuse do humans have?

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December 6, 2015 1:32:55 PM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

Man that monkey's got great teeth.  I dunno, he's looking pretty smug there showing off his pearly whites, maybe "Planet of the Apes" has begun....

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December 6, 2015 1:38:30 PM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

Shallow end of the gene pool?

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December 6, 2015 3:22:13 PM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

Quoting DrJBHL,


Quoting starkers,

Frankly, I don't see why monkeys can't take photos/selfies and own the copyrights to said materials. 



You mean beyond the law dealing with it?

If you take it as a concept, it's absurd that a monkey which has no idea what a photograph/painting, etc. is, should have 'rights' to anything 'produced', really. To take it a step further, what would a monkey do with said 'rights'? Does a monkey have any conception of 'rights', or (more likely) is it a ploy to set PETA (or a bunch of lawyers) up with yet another source of income "administering" those rights and the funds and fees associated with the products? 

Imagine. A whole new field: Monkey (or elephant, whale, etc.) banking, financial services and the governmental aspect: Yes, taxes...more money for politicians, lawyers and bankers. Nah. Better to leave the monkeys to be monkeys wherever and the 'humans' to do what we do best...

Just to push a point.

Thing is, Doc, monkeys do a better job at being human than some humans.  I mean, look at the history of cock-ups perpetrated by the powers that be over the last couple hundred years.  At least a monkey's life is uncomplicated, simplistic and free of taxes, charges and fees.

Yup, I say we fire our current masters and elect a monkey today. 

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December 6, 2015 3:43:21 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

The Alaska Zoo was selling Annabelle's paintings for years.  She made hundreds of thousands of dollars off paintings as an elephant.

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December 6, 2015 3:57:54 PM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

Quoting starkers,

'humans' to do what they do best...

Like screw everything up. Elect the monkey and Annabelle too. They might even do a better job.

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December 6, 2015 4:11:10 PM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

There's no might about it, Ross, not only a better job but far less bullshit and far fewer lies/broken promises.

As for Annabelle, she should be made Speaker.

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December 6, 2015 4:23:52 PM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

In my opinion animals have not devolved to the point where they know how to lie.

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December 6, 2015 4:51:09 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Annabelle died quite quite a few years back, so unless we're going for Speaker for the Dead...

 

Uvah, animals are quite adept at lying.  I had a dog that would shit in the house as revenge for leaving him alone, and then hide the evidence in an attempt to avoid the spanking.  He'd drag around things like rugs, newspapers, covering his mess up before you got back.  The little bastard was a real pain in the ass but when it was too cold to leave him outside, it was too cold.

 

My dad had a dog that was even smarter when he was a kid, he'd clean the tops off with his paws, looking for a good sized carrot, yank the sucker out, clean it, eat it, and dispose of the stem.  The kids got blamed for it since it was so obviously a person doing it, no one suspected the dog until he was caught in the act.

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December 6, 2015 7:01:58 PM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

Don't mistake being vindictive for lying. I have a cat that does the same thing if he doesn't get his own way. In time they get over it.

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December 6, 2015 9:25:40 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Hiding the evidence of the crime dude, subterfuge.

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December 6, 2015 9:33:22 PM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

Quoting Uvah,

In my opinion animals have not devolved to the point where they know how to lie.

And that's why they'd make better politicians... like you could count on it when they said: "I did not have sexual relations with that woman."

More to the point, they wouldn't con the world into invading Iraq [or anywhere else for that matter] over non-existent weapons of mass destruction.

Quoting psychoak,

Uvah, animals are quite adept at lying. I had a dog that would shit in the house as revenge for leaving him alone, and then hide the evidence in an attempt to avoid the spanking. He'd drag around things like rugs, newspapers, covering his mess up before you got back. The little bastard was a real pain in the ass but when it was too cold to leave him outside, it was too cold.

There ya go again, blaming the dog for your failure to keep him properly amused.  Yup, it was your fault he had to resort to playing practical jokes to amuse himself.  He hid those turds deliberately, orright, but not to avoid a "spanking".  No, he did it in the hope you'd step on one and feel the squelch of it spreading under-foot.  You never saw or heard it, but he was laughing like Muttley on the inside.

 

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December 7, 2015 7:58:19 AM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting starkers,
Oh, and Cauldyth, do you hold the copyright for the selfie that is your avatar?

I'd be proud to be a monkey.  Apes are overrated.

 

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December 7, 2015 8:29:19 AM from WinCustomize Forums WinCustomize Forums

Quoting psychoak,

Hiding the evidence of the crime dude, subterfuge.

Separation anxiety can manifest itself in different ways. It isn't a deliberate lie, like saying no I did not when, in fact, I did. The dog must have experienced 'the spanking' and is trying to avoid it. Animals learn by rote. A repeated episode is not forgotten and the response is a primal one. Avoid the hurt.

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December 7, 2015 12:42:10 PM from Elemental Forums Elemental Forums

Quoting Uvah,

In my opinion animals have not devolved to the point where they know how to lie.

 

actually, some studies have shown several species of simians do practice deception / misdirection - especially when hiding food.  Are deception and/or misdirection forms of lying?

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