A farewell to arms

Reflections after a few month of Demigod

By on November 28, 2009 1:12:33 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

MonkeyMaciek

Join Date 09/2009
+3

Hi,

I'm a scientist in my late 20s, I don't usually play computer games but I used to love them as a kid. Recently a friend introduced me to Demigod and I found the strategy options so absorbing that I bought it and have been playing it for a few months (85 games, my overlay tells me). I'm just about to put the game away again but with the 2,408 minutes of play time I've invested online with you guys, it feels a little like I'm leaving a community, so I wanted to introduce myself and share my reflections on the experience.

One of the things that has stopped me from playing online games in the past has been the rudeness and (honestly, I'm rarely so critical of people, but in this case think it's justified) stupidity of most people who seem to play online games. There's only so much patience I, or most adult players I think, have for being told we must be "gay" as though it were an insult before we walk away and leave the children to grow up on their own. As Frogboy also mentioned recenlt, one of the best things about Demigod, and one of the main reason I've stayed as long as I have and have introduced other players to the game, is how rare this kind of behaviour is. Honestly there've only been 4 or 5 games where I've heard this sort of thing and that's a good enough ratio for me.

On the flipside, I've found intelligent conversation to be just as rare. I usually work fairly long hours and play at the lab in the evenings, as a way to wind down before going home. I like learning and trying new startegies, but I'm not die-hard focused on winning and wouldn't mind a bit of casual banter throughout the game - just on how the day's going or recent interesting movies or tidbits of news or reflections on the game or, really, any less-serious casual converstaion. There's been, again, about 4 or 5 occasions where I've met a player online and had a decent chat about something, either in the lobby or in those moments during the game (respawning, farming, taking down a tower, etc) where there's space to type. Those times have really felt like I've been chilling out and enjoying a computer game with cool people. They've been exactly what I was looking for and I'm really grateful for them.

Most of the time though any attempts at conversation have just met silence or just gameplay-focused acronyms. I've never seen a polite decline to converstaion, just, overwhelmingly silence or game-talk. I'm wondering if anyone has insight about  why this is? Is it a lack of English ability? Is the average community member just really young? Is it social skills? Are most people just really, really focused on playing and winning? Is it maybe a major norm-violation on my part to try to make conversation in complete sentences; is there some unspoken rule that everyone but me knows that in-game is only for stricly focused game-playing? Is this peculiar to Demigod or will I find the same in whatever strategy game I play online?

That said, the gameplay has been great and mastering the strategies has been a lot of fun. I ended up being able to build a pretty nasty regulus, if I do say so myself.

All in all, I think the expience has been valuable. The one thing that could have made it better was a way of visibly flagging games as "casual". That way people could self-select into those who take things seriously and really want to win and those who as just casually playing a game. Each seems to be frustrated by the other: the hard-core gamer doesn't like casual players doing badly, chatting, not taking the game seriously enough or experiementing with new DGs or strategies when they should be focused on winning; the casual player tires of the insults, rage-quitting and taking the game too seriously from hard-core gamers.

Anyway, that's me and those are my thoughts as I hit "uninstall". Thanks for sharing this time with me, I'm interested to hear your replies.

 

MonkeyMaciek

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November 28, 2009 1:38:39 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

I've got a ton of games installed on my HD, and a pile of Xbox games on the shelf, because I never know what I will want to play, either solo or with friends.

I've never really looked at a 'community' as a measure of how much enjoyment I get from a game, but to each his own, I guess. 

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November 28, 2009 1:40:10 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

I played a game with you a few nights ago and I recall it as being rather enjoyable. Most of the games I play fall into one of two categories:

-The teamchat is full of entirely me talking, no teammates responding.

-Teammates raging at something retarded.

 

Maybe I'm not playing with the right people? Out of the 70 games that I've played, there've only been about 2 that felt very "casual", one that I lost, one that I won. Both were great. My team got trashed on the game that I lost, but players from both sides were making comments, yourmom jokes, whatever.

 

Winning and losing is so important because of stats, and stats are so important because of players. People care. I for one, would love to have "casual" games, or games that don't count towards your stats. Maybe its just because I'm not that skilled. My win ratio has been steadily declining in the past week, and none of the games that I lost were really that enjoyable or valuable.

 

Besides stats, I really have no idea why most players (or most of the people I've played games with) don't seem to communicate. I dunno.

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November 28, 2009 4:53:10 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

This post reeks of emo gayness.

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November 28, 2009 5:20:16 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting GnomeChomp,
This post reeks of emo gayness.

This post reeks of retardation.

Anyways, sorry to see you go. I don't know about anyone else, but I tend to be a quiet player because I'm a slow typer. I'll tell you about Reg mines near a flag, thank you for saving me, etc, but otherwise ignore general chit-chat.

 

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November 28, 2009 6:18:58 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

wallstop play with me! I have the exact same problem=]

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November 28, 2009 6:23:16 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting GnomeChomp,
This post reeks of emo gayness.

Honestly......what the hell.

I agree with the OP, in the way that I think it brings a team closer together if they can converse happily, rather than insulting each other and being absolute morons when something bad happens. It also comes from a lack of players able to criticise themselves and actually admit they make mistakes, which of course means they'll usually blame others. Likewise, there are a vast majority of people who are just really nice and genuinely want to play and not be idiots. A lot of them are quiet, but that can always mean they don't like talking to people they don't know and stuff like that. It's really good when both teams are having fun and chatting away to each other and making comedic jokes and just in general having good spirit. At the same time, a single person that acts like a moron can break the game for everyone. I'm not pointing any fingers, and I never will (unless it's at myself), but it still doesn't mean we all can't be stupid one day.

Like me; I've got three games and I'm too antisocial to play MP much, and so I worry a lot about winning and not about just having fun when I play online. If I can get rid of that worry, and others can too, I think the community would be better for it; winning isn't everything after all. Sure it looks nice on your profile, but I think having fun is way more important. My two cents.

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November 28, 2009 6:43:57 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Everybodys different

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November 28, 2009 10:51:35 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

A large portion of it is the way many of us get absorbed in trying to play as best we can, and ultimately win. As I'm sure you've noticed, there is little time in-between frantic clicking and strategizing for having a real conversation in-game. There is, of course, a percentage of the population that simply doesn't want to talk, but what I expect the majority of players would love to have a discussion, were we able to easily type while playing the game.


A good proof of this is the increased conversation in games that have built-in voice chat. Compared to games without voice chat, in which I've had barely any conversations that stretched to realms outside the game-world, games with microphones give a significantly higher number of occasions where another player and I were actually talking about something significant.

In short, I'd love to talk, but I'm busy killing this Erebus

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November 29, 2009 1:06:04 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

In short, I'd love to talk, but I'm busy killing this Erebus

Ha, if only you could.

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November 29, 2009 1:09:41 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

I think a lot of it isn't just games/gamers...but simply human nature. Think about how many people you walk past in a grocery store that don't say anything.

Anyways, ignoring all of that, the main reason I'm posting is that I would strongly recommend you check out some MMOs. They are really all about interaction. If you want, you can play just as casually in an MMO as something like DG. The 2 MMOs that are out right now that I would recommend the most from what I read about you, is Lord of The Rings Online, and EVE online, with an emphasis on the second one.


Eve is a sci-fi game, set in another galaxy where you get to control your ship in a full size galaxy with around 75,000 star systems. This game is mind blowing complex, involving a lot of strategy and tactics. It is a single server, so all 350,000+ people play in that same galaxy. Essentially everything in the game is player run, from the market, even to most of the control of the galaxy. There are central regions controlled by NPC factions, but most of the galaxy can be controlled by players. Now for the main down side that drives people away: It is 100 percent pvp. At any time, someone can attack you. Now, if you are in a high-sec area controlled by the NPC factions, they will have a large NPC fleet warp in on them fairly quickly. You can spend all of your time playing the game in high sec if you want to. Eve is very much sand box.

Next is LoTRO: This is a pretty typical fantasy MMO. Set classes, holy-trinity, almost entirely PvE ( fighting NPCs/ai ) etc. LoTRO tends to have a lot more adult community than other MMOs however. If you like fantasy at all, definitely give lotro a try.

Both games have free trials, just check their sites: eve-online.com and lotro.com

Bioware is currently working on a Star Wars MMO ( Star Wars The Old Republic , swtor.com ) that is looking extremely promising.

Cheers!

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November 29, 2009 2:55:14 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Thanks for all the replies and warm sentiments. Hopefuly I'll see you guys again if I find myself missing Demigod, or in the forum of the next interesting strategy game that comes along.

Wallstop: yeah, I remember that game, it was fun Good luck finding other chatty sorts.

Psuedomellon: I wonder if Stardock could be pursuaded to add voice-chat support to Demigod, maybe making it  contingent on players having a fast enough connection? Can you recommend a decent strategy game with voice chat?

GnomeChomp: you watch out for that gayness, I hear it's contagious.

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November 29, 2009 3:31:19 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting MonkeyMaciek,
Thanks for all the replies and warm sentiments. Hopefuly I'll see you guys again if I find myself missing Demigod, or in the forum of the next interesting strategy game that comes along.

Wallstop: yeah, I remember that game, it was fun Good luck finding other chatty sorts.

Psuedomellon: I wonder if Stardock could be pursuaded to add voice-chat support to Demigod, maybe making it  contingent on players having a fast enough connection? Can you recommend a decent strategy game with voice chat?

GnomeChomp: you watch out for that gayness, I hear it's contagious.

Dawn of War 2 has built in voice chat. I enjoy that one from time to time, but I really hate having to use both steam and GFWL at the same time:(

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November 29, 2009 7:15:38 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting MonkeyMaciek,

Psuedomellon: I wonder if Stardock could be pursuaded to add voice-chat support to Demigod, maybe making it  contingent on players having a fast enough connection? Can you recommend a decent strategy game with voice chat?

Hmmmm... First off, don't quote me on this but I -think- I read something about Impulse/Ready-to-Play eventually being capable of supporting voice chat. I dunno. I expect that, at the very least, it will be present in Elemental (a future Stardock game that looks to be coming along quite smoothly).

I've only bought a couple games recently, so I don't know what Strategy games out there are currently good, and I have a feeling the FPS and MoBA genres wouldn't interest you, due to their being filled with children much in the same strand as exhibit A:

Quoting GnomeChomp,
This post reeks of emo gayness.

As soon as I've finished this post I'll PM ZehDon, who if I remember correctly is a pretty avid fan of all things strategy.

Edit:

GnomeChomp: you watch out for that gayness, I hear it's contagious.

I laughed pretty hard at that one

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November 29, 2009 12:11:11 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Emo gayness isn't contagious; if you're not prone to pretentious introspection on an internet forum, chances are you never will be.

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November 29, 2009 12:56:30 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

If you're looking to voice chat while playing a game online, try X-Fire, TeamSpeak or Ventrillo.  If you're able to gather a decent group of folks together, you can chat with them no matter which game you're playing.  Though I do see your points about chatting with people in the same game as you.

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November 29, 2009 3:57:45 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting GnomeChomp,
Emo gayness isn't contagious; if you're not prone to pretentious introspection on an internet forum, chances are you never will be.

Being literate is a crime of pretention. Heaven forbid anyone take the time to think, eh?

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November 29, 2009 7:10:03 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Unfortunately MonkeyMaciek, in online strategy games there are two types of gamers: the ones I label 'Blizzard Players' and everyone one. Blizzard-Players, which I admit is a gross generalisation, usually cut their teeth on any one of Blizzard Entertainment's games and don't communicate often or at all. They expect you to do what needs to doing with no communication or organisation and will flame you the moment the shit hits the fan. Everyone else usually enjoy chatting, often not related to the game. I do my best to communicate.

Demigod is closely related to DotA, a mod for a Blizzard game and home to the worst online community of all tiem. We inherited some of their community when Demigod was launched, although they've generally all migrated over to HoN so things are better than they used to be. 

Most strategy games, unfortunately, simply don't have included Voice Over Internet-Protocol (VOIP) and players are forced to type, and in games of this nature typing can take a while so many players don't do it. As mentioned, running Vent or TeamSpeak or any other VOIP program is highly recommended. Vent is the most common one, in my experience, but it's difficult to get players in a Public game to join a Vent server. Demigod will eventually have it's own VOIP service, but it's a long ways off yet.

From what I've played online, in terms of Public games, Dawn of War 2 has a great multiplayer community that is very open and friendly, although there are a lot of 'hardcore' players as well. If Demigod wasn't your cup of tea, might I suggest trying that one? In terms of Demigod-style games, however, you won't find one with a great, friendly community because they're all closely related to DotA, and that game and it's community is pure toxic waste. Avoid at all costs.

Quoting GnomeChomp,
This post reeks of emo gayness.

The irony of this statement seems to escape you.

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November 29, 2009 7:44:08 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

I generally won't type about the news in a video game when I'm actually doing something that needs my full attention (most of the time in dg, you can't just type a paragraph in chat without something happening on the map.. and every second counts).  In WoW I'll end up typing whatever, as there is a lot of downtime like flying to a location, or farming something or another, and so people can have long conversations in guild chat.

 

Mostly however, Ventrilo is what I use instead of typing.  I'm often silent in my lobbies because I'm chatting away in Vent about w/e.  During the games, it can be serious all into the game, or it can continue the casual convo I'm having in vent until something pops up.. switch to game mode for a sec.. then back to what we were talkin about.  It's awesome.  It might be 3rd party and therefore not part of the game.. but people have done that with a LOT of great games that don't have integrated voice chat.  I think one of the main reasons games DONT bother with integrated voice is because the 3rd party programs are already top notch.  It's like.. cigarettes aren't self-lighting and don't come packaged with matches... but you go out and buy lighters so you can smoke them..  good analogy?  I thought so.  At least.. I want a cig now.  gl

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November 29, 2009 7:44:17 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

I'm pretty sure GnomeChomp was kidding when he said that this post reeks of "emo gayness," whatever the hell that is.

When I look for a casual social experience, I look to games that I can play with friends. It is here that I find the matchmaking system that killed MW2 to be beneficial.

Otherwise, I welcome the competition. The energy spent trying to outplay your opponent is a refreshing change to an otherwise monotonous day.

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November 30, 2009 3:29:55 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

I tend to indulge in both the banter and the focus playing. It seems to be a trademark of the aussie community though, not too sure about the rest.

Don't think i've played many games without someone mentioning, " Was it really worth it?"

ha i remember an occasion where Mixmagic and some random US player were skulling beers against each other whilst we were playing the magical "Just one more" game. Or getting into heated discussion with an opposition canadian player about which country had a cooler flag, whilst attempting to somehow possibly maybe potentially kill his slightly OP erebus.

Playing pantheon and sometimes in Asian games etc theres an assumption that not everyone is going to speak english, but most people seem to recognise smileys and yes/no/nice/shop/b/charachter names etc But i don't think the game would be as enjoyable if it was 100% social though. The varying competitive levels definately make for some fun times too.

VOIP and a whole lot of community features comes along with what looks like the potentially awesome, Impulse Phase 5. It was mentioned in that Stardock 2009 report. No recollection of when it comes out though.

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November 30, 2009 4:50:04 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Peronally I sorta agree. I mean why does no-one ever seem to talk online? Even a hey thanks for saving my ass would be nice. Then again I think I talk too much so ^^

Oh btw

Quoting pseudomelon,
In short, I'd love to talk, but I'm busy killing this Erebus

Stole your kill....

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November 30, 2009 5:07:48 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting _Golgoth_,


Quoting pseudomelon, reply 8In short, I'd love to talk, but I'm busy killing this Erebus

Stole your kill....

...And it took me the entire game to get him that close to death, ya bastard

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November 30, 2009 8:50:52 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

"Being literate is a crime of pretention. Heaven forbid anyone take the time to think, eh?"

Being literate isn't a crime of pretention, but creating melodrama over a non-event is.  Heaven forbid how you would react if something significant ever happened in your life. 

"The irony of this statement seems to escape you."

The double-irony is that it has escaped you.

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November 30, 2009 9:14:04 AM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting pseudomelon,

...And it took me the entire game to get him that close to death, ya bastard

Warp strike + Spine Attack = Kill Steal

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November 30, 2009 6:31:31 PM from Demigod Forums Demigod Forums

Quoting _Golgoth_,
Warp strike + Spine Attack = Kill Steal

Tell me about it! I thought Regulus was bad for it!

Quoting GnomeChomp,
The double-irony is that it has escaped you.

How is this so being I pointed it out? Pretending there was a hidden meaning at this point is, well, pointless.

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